[uf-discuss] hCard names - n vs. fn

Andy Mabbett andy at pigsonthewing.org.uk
Mon Apr 23 12:16:54 PDT 2007

In message
<21e770780704230518l7f8614d3k8daa6ae300b49108 at mail.gmail.com>, Brian
Suda <brian.suda at gmail.com> writes

>On 4/23/07, Paul Wilkins <paul_wilkins at xtra.co.nz> wrote:
>> For the purposes of discussion, a more generic version of this is
>> <div class="vcard">
>>  <span class="n">
>>   <span class="honorific-prefix">The Rt Hon</span>
>>   <span class="fn">Tony Blair</span>
>>   <span class="honorific-suffix">MP</span>
>>  </span>
>> </div>
>> An update may be required, where then fn is looked for first, and parsed out
>> into appropriate n fields, then after that the n fields are updated from the
>> remaining information.
>--- well, this a tricky situation because the author has been MORE
>explicit with the use of the N property. We can happily pick apart
>things from FN when N is not present, but when the author expresses
>deeper semantics IMHO i don't think we should be implying any
>additional information, unless there is a very good reason.

Since you're answering a "copy" of my post, and not the original, I'll
remind you that I went on to say:

Tails gives:

        Name: The Rt Hon Tony Blair MP
        Full Name: Tony Blair
        Given Name: %
        Family Name: %
        Additional Name: %
        Honorific Prefix: The Rt Hon
        Honorific Suffix: MP
        Nickname: %

Operator gives:

        fn=Tony Blair
        object n {
          object honorific-prefix {
                0=The Rt Hon
          object honorific-suffix {

and exports:


        N;CHARSET=UTF-8:;;;The Rt Hon;MP

        FN;CHARSET=UTF-8:Tony Blair

Which is right, and is the mark-up valid? It's not possible to mark up
given- and family- names, as this is template generated, and the
granularity cannot be guaranteed.

>In this situation there are two possibilities.
>1) drop the N all together
>- you lose the extracting of the prefixes and suffixes, but get the
>FN->N correct
>2) add an additional class of 'family-name' to the class="fn"
>- this will incorrectly put the WHOLE FN value in the N's family name field

1) Seems harmful, as data is lost.

2) is, as you say incorrect; but also impossible in the case concerned.

Andy Mabbett
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