From davidjanes at blogmatrix.com Mon Mar 2 09:55:43 2009 From: davidjanes at blogmatrix.com (David Janes) Date: Mon Mar 2 10:23:49 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON Message-ID: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. Regards, etc... [1] http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-json/ -- David Janes Mercenary Programmer http://code.davidjanes.com From kevinmarks at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 12:37:10 2009 From: kevinmarks at gmail.com (Kevin Marks) Date: Mon Mar 2 12:37:12 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON In-Reply-To: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> References: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <73766b160903021237l325eaabased813d842d43e07b@mail.gmail.com> Do have a look at http://portablecontacts.net - the JSON spec there is a good model to go to and from hCard (thats where we staretd from wehn desiging it, before we looked at a lot of other contact schemas too). On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes wrote: > > I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in > particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data > structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. > > Regards, etc... > > [1] http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-json/ > From davidjanes at blogmatrix.com Mon Mar 2 12:59:24 2009 From: davidjanes at blogmatrix.com (David Janes) Date: Mon Mar 2 12:59:29 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON In-Reply-To: <73766b160903021237l325eaabased813d842d43e07b@mail.gmail.com> References: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> <73766b160903021237l325eaabased813d842d43e07b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <21e523c20903021259mb2cb338i841dfb09647570b1@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for the pointer, Kevin. Regards, etc... On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 3:37 PM, Kevin Marks wrote: > Do have a look at http://portablecontacts.net - the JSON spec there is > a good model to go to and from hCard (thats where we staretd from wehn > desiging it, before we looked at a lot of other contact schemas too). > > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes wrote: >> >> I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in >> particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data >> structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. >> >> Regards, etc... >> >> [1] http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-json/ >> > _______________________________________________ > microformats-discuss mailing list > microformats-discuss@microformats.org > http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss > -- David Janes Mercenary Programmer http://code.davidjanes.com From glenn.jones at madgex.com Tue Mar 3 08:41:26 2009 From: glenn.jones at madgex.com (Glenn Jones) Date: Tue Mar 3 09:27:19 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON Message-ID: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F096EE@MOBY.Clarence.local> Hi David I have done quite bit of work around serialising microformats into both JSON and XML. The current version of my UfXtract parser is designed to consider the description of microformats as a loadable profiles. When I want to add a new microformat I build a new profile object. As such I have also been able to build generic JSON/XML serializers and de-serializers for the parser. They allow me to export and import microformats in JSON/XML without any data loss or added ambiguity. A while back I was really interested in moving this work forward within the community to get an agreed standard. There did not seem much interest at the time, so I documented some of my earlier work on wiki [1]. I think that Toby has since done some work with JSON support in Swignition. I have also looked at the Portable Contacts groups work and done some experimental conversions demos [2]. Although I think this project is a good idea, they have taken an approach with the scheme that allows for conversion between the 2 standards but there is some data loss, so it's not truly compatible. jCard[3] is also a good effort, my only problem was I wanted a serialization structure which can be applied to any microformat. It's also interesting to look at the work Yahoo has done with YQL [4], which can parse some microformats and return JSON/XML. Maybe not the best format, but very interesting toolset. Although the microformat design process did not originally have the concept of an output format, there are times when this would be useful. As parsers mature, we need an easy way to support the interchange and integration of data. Not just for parsers, but also for the applications that use them. A standard output format should encourage a greater culture of reuse and sharing between developers and help collaborative projects such as the building of shared test suites and other tools. If you check out the Microformats OAuth demo on my labs site you can see the serializer and de-serializer in action on the test bed page [5]. You have to create an account on the test site first. [6] [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/json [2] http://lab.madgex.com/portablecontacts/ [3] http://microformats.org/wiki/jCard [4] http://developer.yahoo.com/yql/ [5] http://lab.madgex.com/microformats/apidemo/testbed.aspx [6] http://ufapi.lab.madgex.com/ Glenn Jones On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes wrote: > > I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in > particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data > structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. > > Regards, etc... > > [1] > http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-js > on/ > From glenn.jones at madgex.com Tue Mar 3 08:44:29 2009 From: glenn.jones at madgex.com (Glenn Jones) Date: Tue Mar 3 09:27:20 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON Message-ID: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F096F9@MOBY.Clarence.local> Hi David I have done quite bit of work around serialising microformats into both JSON and XML. The current version of my UfXtract parser is designed to consider the description of microformats as a loadable profiles. When I want to add a new microformat I build a new profile object. As such I have also been able to build generic JSON/XML serializers and de-serializers for the parser. They allow me to export and import microformats in JSON/XML without any data loss or added ambiguity. A while back I was really interested in moving this work forward within the community to get an agreed standard. There did not seem much interest at the time, so I documented some of my earlier work on wiki [1]. I think that Toby has since done some work with JSON support in Swignition. I have also looked at the Portable Contacts groups work and done some experimental conversions demos [2]. Although I think this project is a good idea, they have taken an approach with the scheme that allows for conversion between the 2 standards but there is some data loss, so it's not truly compatible. jCard[3] is also a good effort, my only problem was I wanted a serialization structure which can be applied to any microformat. It's also interesting to look at the work Yahoo has done with YQL [4], which can parse some microformats and return JSON/XML. Maybe not the best format, but very interesting toolset. Although the microformat design process did not originally have the concept of an output format, there are times when this would be useful. As parsers mature, we need an easy way to support the interchange and integration of data. Not just for parsers, but also for the applications that use them. A standard output format should encourage a greater culture of reuse and sharing between developers and help collaborative projects such as the building of shared test suites and other tools. If you check out the Microformats OAuth demo on my labs site you can see the serializer and de-serializer in action on the test bed page [5]. You have to create an account on the test site first. [6] [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/json [2] http://lab.madgex.com/portablecontacts/ [3] http://microformats.org/wiki/jCard [4] http://developer.yahoo.com/yql/ [5] http://lab.madgex.com/microformats/apidemo/testbed.aspx [6] http://ufapi.lab.madgex.com/ Glenn Jones On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes wrote: > > I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in > particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data > structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. > > Regards, etc... > > [1] > http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-js > on/ > From glenn.jones at madgex.com Tue Mar 3 06:31:10 2009 From: glenn.jones at madgex.com (Glenn Jones) Date: Tue Mar 3 09:27:23 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON In-Reply-To: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> References: <21e523c20903020955p2d378099o52315fa12730b623@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F095F6@MOBY.Clarence.local> Hi David I have done quite bit of work around serialising microformats into both JSON and XML. The current version of my UfXtract parser is designed to consider the description of microformats as a loadable profiles. When I want to add a new microformat I build a new profile object. As such I have also been able to build generic JSON/XML serializers and de-serializers for the parser. They allow me to export and import microformats in JSON/XML without any data loss or added ambiguity. A while back I was really interested in moving this work forward within the community to get an agreed standard. There did not seem much interest at the time, so I documented some of my earlier work on wiki [1]. I think that Toby has since done some work with JSON support in Swignition. I have also looked at the Portable Contacts groups work and done some experimental conversions demos [2]. Although I think this project is a good idea, they have taken an approach with the scheme that allows for conversion between the 2 standards but there is some data loss, so it's not truly compatible. jCard[3] is also a good effort, my only problem was I wanted a serialization structure which can be applied to any microformat. It's also interesting to look at the work Yahoo has done with YQL [4], which can parse some microformats and return JSON/XML. Maybe not the best format, but very interesting toolset. Although the microformat design process did not originally have the concept of an output format, there are times when this would be useful. As parsers mature, we need an easy way to support the interchange and integration of data. Not just for parsers, but also for the applications that use them. A standard output format should encourage a greater culture of reuse and sharing between developers and help collaborative projects such as the building of shared test suites and other tools. If you check out the Microformats OAuth demo on my labs site you can see the serializer and de-serializer in action on the test bed page [5]. You have to create an account on the test site first. [6] [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/json [2] http://lab.madgex.com/portablecontacts/ [3] http://microformats.org/wiki/jCard [4] http://developer.yahoo.com/yql/ [5] http://lab.madgex.com/microformats/apidemo/testbed.aspx [6] http://ufapi.lab.madgex.com/ Glenn Jones On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes wrote: > > I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in > particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data > structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. > > Regards, etc... > > [1] > http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-js > on/ > From jmyers at visi.com Tue Mar 3 14:38:38 2009 From: jmyers at visi.com (Jay Myers) Date: Tue Mar 3 14:53:41 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hProduct issues responses and recipies Message-ID: All, I have posted a few responses to the hProduct issues list [1], please take a moment to review and post your feedback. I agree with Tantek that we can be using formats as building blocks, and have set up an additional hProduct recipe page [2] (using a modified version of the hProduct schema based on suggestions from the issues list and draft page) with example markup to highlight the possible relationships between stable, draft and proposed microformats. [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/hproduct-issues [2] http://microformats.org/wiki/hproduct-recipes Jay twitter: @jaymyers blog: http://jay.beweep.com From kevinmarks at gmail.com Tue Mar 3 11:01:50 2009 From: kevinmarks at gmail.com (Kevin Marks) Date: Tue Mar 3 20:10:33 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] FYI: serialization of hCard into JSON In-Reply-To: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F096EE@MOBY.Clarence.local> References: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F096EE@MOBY.Clarence.local> Message-ID: <73766b160903031101w239da2f6u1c64ab964f4944f9@mail.gmail.com> Whats the data loss? One of the nice things about these tools is that you can chain them, eg piping hCard into PoCo through vCard: : http://www.plaxo.com/pdata/vcard?vcardUrl=feeds.technorati.com%2Fcontacts%2Fkevinmarks.com and piping the result into XOXO for easier human readability: http://kevinmarks.com/cgi-bin/jsontoxoxo.py?url=http://pulse.plaxo.com/pulse/pdata/vcard?vcardUrl=feeds.technorati.com%2Fcontacts%2Fkevinmarks.com On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 8:41 AM, Glenn Jones wrote: > Hi David > > I have done quite bit of work around serialising microformats into both > JSON and XML. The current version of my UfXtract parser is designed to > consider the description of microformats as a loadable profiles. ?When I > want to add a new microformat I build a new profile object. ?As such I > have also been able to build generic JSON/XML serializers and > de-serializers for the parser. They allow me to export and import > microformats in JSON/XML without any data loss or added ambiguity. > > A while back I was really interested in moving this work forward within > the community to get an agreed standard. There did not seem much > interest at the time, so I documented some of my earlier work on wiki > [1]. ?I think that Toby has since done some work with JSON support in > Swignition. > > I have also looked at the Portable Contacts groups work and done some > experimental conversions demos [2]. ?Although I think this project is a > good idea, they have taken an approach with the scheme that allows for > conversion between the 2 standards but there is some data loss, so it's > not truly compatible. > > jCard[3] is also a good effort, my only problem was I wanted a > serialization structure which can be applied to any microformat. > > It's also interesting to look at the work Yahoo has done with YQL [4], > which can parse some microformats and return JSON/XML. Maybe not the > best format, but very interesting toolset. > > Although the microformat design process did not originally have the > concept of an output format, there are times when this would be useful. > As parsers mature, we need an easy way to support the interchange and > integration of data. Not just for parsers, but also for the applications > that use them. > > A standard output format should encourage a greater culture of reuse and > sharing between developers and help collaborative projects such as the > building of shared test suites and other tools. > > If you check out the Microformats OAuth demo on my labs site you can see > the serializer and de-serializer in action on the test bed page [5]. > You have to create an account on the test site first. [6] > > [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/json > [2] http://lab.madgex.com/portablecontacts/ > [3] http://microformats.org/wiki/jCard > [4] http://developer.yahoo.com/yql/ > [5] http://lab.madgex.com/microformats/apidemo/testbed.aspx > [6] http://ufapi.lab.madgex.com/ > > > Glenn Jones > > > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:55 AM, David Janes > wrote: >> >> I've been playing about with representing microformats ... hCard in >> particular ... efficiently and usefully into JSON-type data >> structures. Here's a blog post on the topic [1]. >> >> Regards, etc... >> >> [1] >> http://code.davidjanes.com/blog/2009/03/02/auapi-encoding-hcards-in-js >> on/ >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > microformats-discuss mailing list > microformats-discuss@microformats.org > http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss > From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Thu Mar 5 07:11:38 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Thu Mar 5 07:11:52 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. Message-ID: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> In hcalendar, how can I show a list of irregular dates for meetings with identical summaries showing only one summary in the html? In the web site it will just be a paragraph (or heading) with the summary followed by a bulleted list of dates (around 10 to 20). I really did not wish to show on the website the same summary 10 to 20 times (but I understand that the summary is mandatory for a Vevent). I realise that when converted to an ical file (for example) each date needs its summary to spread around the users calendar or they would not know what the event on that particular day was. I saw one hint that it is possible to comma separate dates in a DTSTART (omitting DTEND I presume) - is that valid and is there an example anywhere? I have searched all last years posts on this list and cannot find an answer there. Thanks in advance. Ray (Newbie calling for help....) I did consider abandoning the microformat and using a webcal URL pointing to an ICS file... From glenn.jones at madgex.com Thu Mar 5 09:54:50 2009 From: glenn.jones at madgex.com (Glenn Jones) Date: Thu Mar 5 09:54:51 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> Message-ID: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> Hi Ray > In hcalendar, how can I show a list of irregular dates for meetings with > identical summaries showing only one summary in the html? You should be able to do the following:
Title of event
A little bit of information about the event
location
Dates:
  • Sunday 1st March
  • Thursday 5th March
  • Friday 6th March 3:45pm - 4:45pm
Use the objects to include a single summary, description and location into different calendar events. But some of the parsers validate before pulling in the includes, so they say its invalid as the vevent does not contain a summary class. Interesting problem so I am still thinking. There is a format in the ISO Date structure which deals with this, but I bet only Toby's parser can will understand the repeating dates !! Just out of interest if you add a blank summary to the vevent it will work in Operator. Although it should not as summary is singular value in the spec. i.e
  • Sunday 1st March
    • Glenn Jones From mail at tobyinkster.co.uk Thu Mar 5 10:20:12 2009 From: mail at tobyinkster.co.uk (Toby A Inkster) Date: Thu Mar 5 10:40:02 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. Message-ID: Try iCalendar's RDATE property.

    My Irregular Meeting

    Dates: 2001-01-01 2003-01-01 2003-01-02 2004-05-12 2004-07-30 2009-02-01 2011-02-01 2011-02-04
    -- Toby A Inkster From danbri at danbri.org Thu Mar 5 10:06:29 2009 From: danbri at danbri.org (Dan Brickley) Date: Thu Mar 5 12:45:06 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> Message-ID: <49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> On 5/3/09 18:54, Glenn Jones wrote: [...] > There is a format in the ISO Date structure which deals with this, but I > bet only Toby's parser can will understand the repeating dates !! Any chance all this wisdom-of-the-parser-writers could be captured somewhere other than in email? A test suite in svn somewhere, with some representation of expected parser output, or just the wiki...? cheers, Dan From tantek at cs.stanford.edu Thu Mar 5 13:13:01 2009 From: tantek at cs.stanford.edu (Tantek Celik) Date: Thu Mar 5 13:13:12 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net><36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local><49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> Message-ID: <445889412-1236287598-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-432825150-@bxe1043.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> For implementation specific comments, feedback, bugs, features etc. add nested list items under the entry for the implementation on http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-implementations Thanks, Tantek -----Original Message----- From: Dan Brickley Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 19:06:29 To: Microformats Discuss Subject: Re: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. On 5/3/09 18:54, Glenn Jones wrote: [...] > There is a format in the ISO Date structure which deals with this, but I > bet only Toby's parser can will understand the repeating dates !! Any chance all this wisdom-of-the-parser-writers could be captured somewhere other than in email? A test suite in svn somewhere, with some representation of expected parser output, or just the wiki...? cheers, Dan _______________________________________________ microformats-discuss mailing list microformats-discuss@microformats.org http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss From mdagn at spraci.com Thu Mar 5 21:28:06 2009 From: mdagn at spraci.com (Michael MD) Date: Thu Mar 5 21:30:44 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <007b01c99e1c$57286db0$05794910$@com> > Try iCalendar's RDATE property. Does much software actually implement this kind of thing in the iCal world? Or is it still kind of maybe/maybe not (not to be relied apon) like timezones! From mail at tobyinkster.co.uk Sat Mar 7 03:22:52 2009 From: mail at tobyinkster.co.uk (Toby A Inkster) Date: Sat Mar 7 03:23:06 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. Message-ID: <5EBAD679-74B9-445C-A9A7-F0401F2493AD@tobyinkster.co.uk> Michael MD wrote: > Does much software actually implement this kind of thing in the > iCal world? Outlook certainly does - I've seen RDATEs and EXDATEs in the iCalendar files it produces. Lotus Notes does too. Apple iCal doesn't seem to. Google Calendar apparently does, but only if all the recurrences have the same duration. In terms of hCalendar software, X2V seems to support them, as does Swignition. Not tested any others. -- Toby A Inkster From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sat Mar 7 09:39:04 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sat Mar 7 10:23:15 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B2B138.6070607@attglobal.net> Toby A Inkster wrote: > Try iCalendar's RDATE property. > >
    >

    My Irregular Meeting

    >
    > Dates: > 2001-01-01 > 2003-01-01 ....etc, >
    >
    > Toby, first trial- I used:
    CMCF Sunday opening 2009
    2nd Sunday of the warm months
    AprilMayJuneJulyAugustSeptemberOctober
    12th 10th 14th 12th 9th 14th 11th
    I only used tails in Firefox but the result was: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.7.2 (BETA)//EN CALSCALE:GREGORIAN VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT UID: DTSTAMP:19990101T010000Z SUMMARY;CHARSET=UTF-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART:20090412T00000 RDATE:/ RDATE:/ RDATE:/ RDATE:/ RDATE:/ RDATE:/ END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR Which does not give me confidence having no dates in the RDATE entries. Tails correctly parsed all the content except for the repeat dates. I then used http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/ which did even worse resulting in: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.9.2.1 (BETA)//EN X-ORIGINAL-URL:http://pws.prserv.net/oignies/agenda_english.htm X-WR-CALNAME;CHARSET=utf-8:Diary VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:12th RDATE;VALUE=PERIOD:/ END:VEVENT which did not even get the first dtstart correct and incorrectly ignored the title and replaced it with the html text. I think RDATE is not yet ready for prime time unless you can see a blunder by me. Look yourself if you wish it is mounted on: http://pws.prserv.net/oignies/agenda_english.htm Please ignore the rest of the site, it is just a test site, not really live. Ray From foolistbar at googlemail.com Sat Mar 7 10:47:47 2009 From: foolistbar at googlemail.com (Geoffrey Sneddon) Date: Sat Mar 7 10:47:54 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] Practicality of @rel='tag' Message-ID: <86D671CC-B7BA-4C4E-B482-88B265029D20@googlemail.com> Hi, I've been trying to use hResume for my CV, and while mostly it has been logical enough, the use of @rel='tag' for @class='skill' doesn't seem so sensible. Firstly, what does @rel='tag' aim to achieve? The spec makes it seem like semantics for the point of semantics. Assuming the use would be to allow people to query, e.g., databases containing CVs based upon skills, it seems to (by its distributed nature) fail. If I were to list as a skill "Namespaces in XML" there would be two obvious URIs I could use for it ? both with different final segments ? would result in "xml- names", whereas would result in "XML_Namespaces". By having (at least) two different tags for one object, what have we gained by having such tagging at all? What is gained over just using Namespaces in XML? -- Geoffrey Sneddon From mail at tobyinkster.co.uk Sat Mar 7 14:40:55 2009 From: mail at tobyinkster.co.uk (Toby A Inkster) Date: Sat Mar 7 14:40:56 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. Message-ID: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> Ray Foulkes wrote: > I think RDATE is not yet ready for prime time unless you can see a > blunder by me. At least two: > 9th 1. The pattern only works with the element - not the element. 2. The "T" in those dates shouldn't be there. "T" is only used as a separator for the date and time in a datetime. Try: 9th -- Toby A Inkster From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sun Mar 8 03:29:21 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sun Mar 8 03:29:28 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> References: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> Message-ID: <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> > At least two: >> 9th ... > Try: > 9th Thanks Toby, I did say I was a newbie did I not? Originally I had a datetime but I thought that I had to remove the time because I had no dtend - and goofed the syntax... Anyway, I have tried the above without much success. What I did was to a) implement your correction above in my table resulting in lines like: 12th b) pasted the exact text from your mail immediately below the table. c) below that pasted your exact text but replaced your with the above (i.e. resulting in 3 separate Vevents). d) check using Amaya that I have no syntax errors in the page. Unfortunately neither tails nor x2v pick up the rdates in any of the above. The resulting ICS file (truncating the one bit that works) is: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.9.2.1 (BETA)//EN X-ORIGINAL-URL:http://pws.prserv.net/oignies/agenda_english.htm X-WR-CALNAME;CHARSET=utf-8:Diary VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20090412 RDATE;VALUE=PERIOD:/ END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:My Irregular Meeting DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20010101 RDATE;VALUE=PERIOD:/ END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:My Irregular Meeting bis DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20090412 RDATE;VALUE=PERIOD:/ END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT .....Single event that works fine. END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR Just to add some further complexity, when I first start "tails" I get a number of Javascript errors viz: 'xmdp_addr' not found 'xmdp_fn' not found 'xmdp_org' not found 'xmdp_title' not found 'xmdp_tel' not found Which do not repeat if I refresh the page. I know that this is not your problem, but nevertheless it exists. Tails gives no better results than x2V. Since I am really trying to drain the swamp, I think I had better find a way around these alligators for the moment. Thanks for your assistance. Ray From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sun Mar 8 04:01:49 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sun Mar 8 04:01:54 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> Message-ID: <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> Glenn Jones wrote: >
    >
    Title of event
    >
    A little bit of information about the > event
    >
    location
    >
    > > Dates: >
      >
    • > Sunday 1st > March > type="text/html" width="1" height="1" style="display:none"> >
      • >
    • > Thursday 5th > March > type="text/html" width="1" height="1" style="display:none"> >
      • >
    • > Friday > 6th March 3:45pm - > title="06-03-2009T16:45">4:45pm > type="text/html" width="1" height="1" style="display:none"> >
      • >
    > Glenn, thanks for trying to help, but I cannot get the above to work at all. I pasted it in exactly as you have given to avoid added errors from me. It is not seen at all in Firefox by Operator or Tails and the result from X2V does not carry the information through to the events viz: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.9.2.1 (BETA)//EN X-ORIGINAL-URL:http://pws.prserv.net/oignies/agenda_english.htm X-WR-CALNAME;CHARSET=utf-8:Diary VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:01032009 END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:05032009 END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:06032009T001545 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:06032009T001645 END:VEVENT So, as I said to Toby "time to get on draining the swamp" - sorry to have wasted your time. I intend either to double code the events by offering an ICS file or just encourage people to use Google calendars! I will leave in the microformat for the single event though. Thanks for all your assistance, Ray From jeremy at adactio.com Sun Mar 8 07:45:49 2009 From: jeremy at adactio.com (Jeremy Keith) Date: Sun Mar 8 07:45:53 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> Message-ID: <6662F925-BDC1-499D-8211-30F7456AEAE1@adactio.com> Ray wrote: > Glenn, thanks for trying to help, but I cannot get the above to work > at all. There was a little typo in Glenn's original email. The first instance of the class attribute here:
    Title of event
    A little bit of information about the event
    location
    Should be an ID:
    Title of event
    A little bit of information about the event
    location
    That's what should allow the include pattern to work: HTH, Jeremy -- Jeremy Keith a d a c t i o http://adactio.com/ From brian.suda at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 00:09:57 2009 From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda) Date: Tue Mar 10 00:10:04 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> References: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> Message-ID: <21e770780903100109g18981169kb6c230defebdca0d@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 11:29 AM, Ray Foulkes wrote: > Unfortunately neither tails nor x2v pick up the rdates in any of the above. > The resulting ICS file (truncating the one bit that works) is: --- The way X2V works on RDATE is comma delimated, not individual class="rdate" entries. If you try something similar to: 9/01?9/02, 1/05?9/06 X2V should produce better ics output. If anyone wants to discuss other possible ways of parsing RDATE, we should should take it to the dev list. -brian -- brian suda http://suda.co.uk From brian.suda at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 00:12:21 2009 From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda) Date: Tue Mar 10 00:12:25 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> Message-ID: <21e770780903100112s2ff83bcbkf8b05174987b1f5d@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Dan Brickley wrote: > Any chance all this wisdom-of-the-parser-writers could be captured somewhere > other than in email? A test suite in svn somewhere, with some representation > of expected parser output, or just the wiki...? --- there is a test suite, but not much has been done with it in a while. You can see the files and expected output here: http://hg.microformats.org/tests -brian -- brian suda http://suda.co.uk From jmyers at visi.com Tue Mar 10 12:19:30 2009 From: jmyers at visi.com (Jay Myers) Date: Tue Mar 10 12:19:40 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] Transactional attributes in hListing? In-Reply-To: <5EBAD679-74B9-445C-A9A7-F0401F2493AD@tobyinkster.co.uk> References: <5EBAD679-74B9-445C-A9A7-F0401F2493AD@tobyinkster.co.uk> Message-ID: Since there has been much talk on the wiki of delegating attributes in hProduct 0.1 draft to hListing, and seeing that the attributes being delegated don't appear in hListing, I have logged issues on the hListing issues page [1]. Per the hProduct issues list [2], suggestions were made for attributes like "shipping" , and "buy/payment", to be added to hListing -- terms that apply to the transactional nature of a listing, rather than a product. I'd be interested to hear any comments or feedback from the original hListing participants, or from the community in general. [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/hlisting-issues [2] http://microformats.org/wiki/hproduct-issues Jay twitter: @jaymyers blog: http://jay.beweep.com From jmyers at visi.com Tue Mar 10 14:16:14 2009 From: jmyers at visi.com (Jay Myers) Date: Tue Mar 10 14:16:17 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hproduct - new draft available In-Reply-To: <445889412-1236287598-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-432825150-@bxe1043.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B014A5.2020105@danbri.org> <445889412-1236287598-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-432825150-@bxe1043.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: All, I have published an updated version of the hProduct microformat, version 0.2, on the wiki [1], along with some additional notes around the relationship of hProduct to other microformats. Please feel free to post any issues to the issues list [2] or comments to the [uf-discuss] mailing list. [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/hproduct [2] http://microformats.org/wiki/hproduct-issues Thanks, Jay twitter: @jaymyers blog: http://jay.beweep.com From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sat Mar 14 07:47:37 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sat Mar 14 07:47:50 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <6662F925-BDC1-499D-8211-30F7456AEAE1@adactio.com> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> <6662F925-BDC1-499D-8211-30F7456AEAE1@adactio.com> Message-ID: <49BBD199.60404@attglobal.net> Still struggling: I managed to make Operator "see" multiple events. I had each event in a table thus: 12th I moved the formatting information to the css file. This looked just fine when I used my browser locally i.e. Operator listed all the events and each had a title. Unfortunately, when I upload it to the test website, the Apache server (which I do not control directly) delivers it to the browser looking like this: 12th i.e. the "object" has been removed in its entirety. Hence nothing is seen by Operator. Tails did not see multiple events anyway. I think I will give one last shot to Brian Suda's suggestion with RDATE before I abandon microformats for this particular application. I cannot afford more time on this small aspect of my efforts, sorry. From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sat Mar 14 09:25:57 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sat Mar 14 09:26:03 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <21e770780903100109g18981169kb6c230defebdca0d@mail.gmail.com> References: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> <21e770780903100109g18981169kb6c230defebdca0d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BBE8A5.2090509@attglobal.net> Brian Suda wrote: ... > --- The way X2V works on RDATE is comma delimated, not individual > class="rdate" entries. If you try something similar to: > > title="2001-09-10/2002-09-01,2005-01-01/2006-09-01"> title="2001-09-10" class="dtstart dtstamp">9/01?9/02, > 1/05?9/06 OK, I entered:

    My Irregular Meeting

    Dates: 12/04List of dates Tails produced: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.7.2 (BETA)//EN CALSCALE:GREGORIAN VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT UID: DTSTAMP:19990101T010000Z SUMMARY;CHARSET=UTF-8:My Irregular Meeting DTSTART:20090412 DTSTAMP:20090412 RDATE;VALUE=PERIOD:20090412T001400/20090412T001800,20090510T001400/20090510T001800,20090614T001400/20090614T001800,20090712T001400/20090712T001800,20090809T001400/20090809T001800,20090914T001400/20090914T001800,20091011T001400/20091011T001800 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR Which at least looks OK (I think). Operator produced: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID: X-ORIGINAL-URL:file:///I:/Ray/websites/test%20download/cmcf.oignies.free.fr/agenda_englisholdtest.htm X-WR-CALNAME: VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=UTF-8:My Irregular Meeting UID: DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20090412 DTSTAMP:2009-04-12 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR which misses out the RDATE stuff entirely. Unfortunately the output from Tails was accepted neither by Sunbird 0.9 nor by Google calendar. I really think that I am an amateur trying to use routinely something at the bleeding edge. I need to ignore the alligators and get back to draining the swamp. Thank you all very much for trying to assist a newbie to this, but I think I will tell folk to look up Google calendars if they want to import stuff. Ray From brian.suda at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 10:06:04 2009 From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda) Date: Sat Mar 14 10:06:07 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49BBE8A5.2090509@attglobal.net> References: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> <21e770780903100109g18981169kb6c230defebdca0d@mail.gmail.com> <49BBE8A5.2090509@attglobal.net> Message-ID: <21e770780903141106o2ca61978l606599627a956423@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 5:25 PM, Ray Foulkes wrote: >Tails produced: ... > which misses out the RDATE stuff entirely. > Unfortunately the output from Tails was accepted neither by Sunbird 0.9 nor > by Google calendar. --- i think Tails is a very old implementation and has not been updated in a long time. It is probably not the best to bleeding-edge tricks with. I would stick with Operator or X2V. Let us know if those are importable via Sunbird or Google Calendar. -brian -- brian suda http://suda.co.uk From mdagn at spraci.com Sat Mar 14 23:10:23 2009 From: mdagn at spraci.com (MichaelMD) Date: Sat Mar 14 23:12:05 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <49BBD199.60404@attglobal.net> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> <6662F925-BDC1-499D-8211-30F7456AEAE1@adactio.com> <49BBD199.60404@attglobal.net> Message-ID: <1237101023.6313.6.camel@droid2.lan> On Sat, 2009-03-14 at 16:47 +0100, Ray Foulkes wrote: > Unfortunately, when I upload it to the test website, the Apache server > (which I do not control directly) delivers it to the browser looking > like this: > 12th > I have never seen apache do anything like that! maybe use class="include" instead of the object tag? (as suggested here: http://microformats.org/wiki/include-pattern ) From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sun Mar 15 01:19:40 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sun Mar 15 01:47:10 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <21e770780903141106o2ca61978l606599627a956423@mail.gmail.com> References: <224104D7-C6A3-4B27-87EC-DFD5BA01A38D@tobyinkster.co.uk> <49B3AC11.4040300@attglobal.net> <21e770780903100109g18981169kb6c230defebdca0d@mail.gmail.com> <49BBE8A5.2090509@attglobal.net> <21e770780903141106o2ca61978l606599627a956423@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BCC82C.2040100@attglobal.net> > --- i think Tails is a very old implementation and has not been > updated in a long time. It is probably not the best to bleeding-edge > tricks with. I would stick with Operator or X2V. Let us know if those > are importable via Sunbird or Google Calendar. Brian, sorry that my previous email was not well delimited, but the output from Operator was there as well (just below the Tails output). In that case there were NO RDATEs in the output, so no point in sending it to Sunbird or Google 'cause they weren't there. Tails detected the RDATES OK but not Operator. I thought Tails looked quite pretty in the side panel, I had no idea it was a bit long in the tooth. Should I test using yet another plugin? This is what I used for the input, I hope it was OK:

    My Irregular Meeting

    Dates: 12/04 List of dates etc.... I did not even realise that it was legal to nest before your mail! To avoid you searching, this is what Operator produces from the above on my Firefox 3 (Windows XP) with local files: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID: X-ORIGINAL-URL:file:///I:/Ray/websites/test%20download/cmcf.oignies.free.fr/agenda_englisholdtest.htm X-WR-CALNAME: VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY;CHARSET=UTF-8:My Irregular Meeting UID: DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20090412 DTSTAMP:2009-04-12 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR Tails managed to put in the RDATEs though Google and Sunbird did nothing with them. Ray From Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net Sun Mar 15 09:48:45 2009 From: Ray.Foulkes at attglobal.net (Ray Foulkes) Date: Sun Mar 15 09:48:55 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] hcalendar - irregular repeat of identical meeting. In-Reply-To: <1237101023.6313.6.camel@droid2.lan> References: <49AFEBAA.50702@attglobal.net> <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02F09E0B@MOBY.Clarence.local> <49B3B3AD.9030700@attglobal.net> <6662F925-BDC1-499D-8211-30F7456AEAE1@adactio.com> <49BBD199.60404@attglobal.net> <1237101023.6313.6.camel@droid2.lan> Message-ID: <49BD3F7D.2050201@attglobal.net> MichaelMD wrote: ..... > I have never seen apache do anything like that! You are correct the culprit is not Apache, I was in error. I have now uploaded it to 2 sites www.cmcf-oignies.com/agenda_englishwithrdate.htm and http://pws.prserv.net/oignies/agenda_englishwithrdate.htm When I look at both these sites with Firefox, the "object" entries have gone and Operator shows no dates. However, I have found the culprit and it is not Apache but my Norton personal firewall. I have "active objects" (e.g. ActiveX) turned off. I guess Norton thinks that the Objects are in some way bad and removes them silently, but not from local files. Sigh. Nevertheless it sort-of negates the use of the tag since I do not wish to encourage end-users to permit active objects in their browsing. > maybe use class="include" instead of the object tag? > > (as suggested here: http://microformats.org/wiki/include-pattern ) > I looked at the reference above, thanks for pointing that out. What I think it says is that "includes" can be used only in 2 tags, and anchor . I have done this with the results below which look OK in the browser. I have used the property of the anchor that it need not have content.

    Events at Centre de Denis Papin a Oignies in 2009

    Open Sundays

    The centre is open to the public from 14:00 to 18:00 on the following days:

    CMCF Sunday opening 2009
    CMCF is in the town of Oignies close to Lille, France,
    and is open on the 2nd Sunday of the warm months
    AprilMayJuneJulyAugustSeptemberOctober
    12th 10th 14th 12th 9th 13th 11th
    But, sigh, here goes another tale -- why always me? Using Firefox I had to put the dtend first otherwise the abbr shows the end time, not the opening time in the popup box. Tails shows only one event, the first, but Operator shows them all and correctly. The only tedious bit is that you have to save them one at a time in Operator. You CAN import the individual .ics files into Google but not into sunbird (does nothing). BUT when I use http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/ I get the following, with TWO DTSTARTs and DTENDs per VEVENT. I really think this is too bleeding edge for me, I have to get on with other things.. Here is the output: BEGIN:VCALENDAR PRODID:-//suda.co.uk//X2V 0.9.2.1 (BETA)//EN X-ORIGINAL-URL:http://www.cmcf-oignies.fr/agenda_english.htm X-WR-CALNAME;CHARSET=utf-8:Diary VERSION:2.0 METHOD:PUBLISH BEGIN:VEVENT DESCRIPTION;CHARSET=utf-8:open on the 2nd Sunday of the warm months LOCATION;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF is in the town of Oignies close to Lille\, France SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T180000 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T180000 END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT DESCRIPTION;CHARSET=utf-8:open on the 2nd Sunday of the warm months LOCATION;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF is in the town of Oignies close to Lille\, France SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T180000 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090510T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090510T180000 END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT DESCRIPTION;CHARSET=utf-8:open on the 2nd Sunday of the warm months LOCATION;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF is in the town of Oignies close to Lille\, France SUMMARY;CHARSET=utf-8:CMCF Sunday opening 2009 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090412T180000 DTSTART;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090614T140000 DTEND;VALUE=DATE-TIME:20090614T180000 END:VEVENT BEGIN:VEVENT From glenn.jones at madgex.com Mon Mar 16 05:03:26 2009 From: glenn.jones at madgex.com (Glenn Jones) Date: Mon Mar 16 05:02:47 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] Social Graph Explorer and Identify Message-ID: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02FC867A@MOBY.Clarence.local> Hi All I built two new demo's for the Microformats panel at SXSW. The aim was to try and show the power of rel=me. Social Graph Explorer This is a tool which can be used to explorer an individual's combined web identity across various social network/media sites. It takes a social network profile URL (i.e. twitter.com/glennjones) and tries to find out what it can about that individual. Once it has return a combined web profile you can also drill into some of the public content that person has published on the web. It makes extensive use of Google's Social Graph API , microformats, RSS and Atom. http://lab.madgex.com/socialgraph/socialgraphexplorer.aspx Identify - Firefox extension Identify is a Firefox extension that combines identities across various social network/media sites and provides you with a profile about an individual. http://lab.madgex.com/identify/ Currently Social Graph Explorer is a much more powerful and accurate. It uses a rule set which includes the hcard-xfn pattern and a extended version representative hCard idea. Identify uses YQL and needs a little more work in this area, so you may get false positives. I am going to keep working on Identify. Any feedback is most welcome. Glenn Jones From info at csarven.ca Mon Mar 16 06:38:40 2009 From: info at csarven.ca (Sarven Capadisli) Date: Mon Mar 16 06:38:48 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] Social Graph Explorer and Identify In-Reply-To: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02FC867A@MOBY.Clarence.local> References: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02FC867A@MOBY.Clarence.local> Message-ID: <1237214320.7046.17.camel@csarven-laptop> Way to go! Might want to update Identica's favicon with: http://identi.ca/favicon.ico Noticed a few odd stuff in Identify but as you said it is still new. Might want to see "/sarven-capadisli" come up at http://identi.ca/csarven which points to an nonexistent URI: http://identi.ca/sarven-capadisli BTW, which 'note' is being grabbed for the hCard? And are you concatenating all possibly results in SGE and Identify? -Sarven On Mon, 2009-03-16 at 13:03 +0000, Glenn Jones wrote: > Hi All > > I built two new demo's for the Microformats panel at SXSW. The aim was > to try and show the power of rel=me. > > Social Graph Explorer > This is a tool which can be used to explorer an individual's combined > web identity across various social network/media sites. It takes a > social network profile URL (i.e. twitter.com/glennjones) and tries to > find out what it can about that individual. Once it has return a > combined web profile you can also drill into some of the public content > that person has published on the web. It makes extensive use of Google's > Social Graph API , microformats, RSS and Atom. > http://lab.madgex.com/socialgraph/socialgraphexplorer.aspx > > Identify - Firefox extension > Identify is a Firefox extension that combines identities across various > social network/media sites and provides you with a profile about an > individual. > http://lab.madgex.com/identify/ > > > Currently Social Graph Explorer is a much more powerful and accurate. It > uses a rule set which includes the hcard-xfn pattern and a extended > version representative hCard idea. Identify uses YQL and needs a little > more work in this area, so you may get false positives. I am going to > keep working on Identify. > > Any feedback is most welcome. > > > Glenn Jones > > > > _______________________________________________ > microformats-discuss mailing list > microformats-discuss@microformats.org > http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss From karstenj at windows.microsoft.com Mon Mar 16 07:48:49 2009 From: karstenj at windows.microsoft.com (Karsten Januszewski) Date: Mon Mar 16 07:47:34 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] Social Graph Explorer and Identify In-Reply-To: <1237214320.7046.17.camel@csarven-laptop> References: <36A319113CF910438942741C4727ADFF02FC867A@MOBY.Clarence.local>, <1237214320.7046.17.camel@csarven-laptop> Message-ID: <406D6FEFCBB98643A34170C59E1ABEF31FC1D16ACD@NA-EXMSG-W601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Hat's off to Glenn. I was there when he demo'd it at SxSW and it was very well received. Provocative prototypes... Karsten Januszewski ________________________________________ From: microformats-discuss-bounces@microformats.org [microformats-discuss-bounces@microformats.org] On Behalf Of Sarven Capadisli [info@csarven.ca] Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 7:38 AM To: Microformats Discuss Subject: Re: [uf-discuss] Social Graph Explorer and Identify Way to go! Might want to update Identica's favicon with: http://identi.ca/favicon.ico Noticed a few odd stuff in Identify but as you said it is still new. Might want to see "/sarven-capadisli" come up at http://identi.ca/csarven which points to an nonexistent URI: http://identi.ca/sarven-capadisli BTW, which 'note' is being grabbed for the hCard? And are you concatenating all possibly results in SGE and Identify? -Sarven On Mon, 2009-03-16 at 13:03 +0000, Glenn Jones wrote: > Hi All > > I built two new demo's for the Microformats panel at SXSW. The aim was > to try and show the power of rel=me. > > Social Graph Explorer > This is a tool which can be used to explorer an individual's combined > web identity across various social network/media sites. It takes a > social network profile URL (i.e. twitter.com/glennjones) and tries to > find out what it can about that individual. Once it has return a > combined web profile you can also drill into some of the public content > that person has published on the web. It makes extensive use of Google's > Social Graph API , microformats, RSS and Atom. > http://lab.madgex.com/socialgraph/socialgraphexplorer.aspx > > Identify - Firefox extension > Identify is a Firefox extension that combines identities across various > social network/media sites and provides you with a profile about an > individual. > http://lab.madgex.com/identify/ > > > Currently Social Graph Explorer is a much more powerful and accurate. It > uses a rule set which includes the hcard-xfn pattern and a extended > version representative hCard idea. Identify uses YQL and needs a little > more work in this area, so you may get false positives. I am going to > keep working on Identify. > > Any feedback is most welcome. > > > Glenn Jones > > > > _______________________________________________ > microformats-discuss mailing list > microformats-discuss@microformats.org > http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss _______________________________________________ microformats-discuss mailing list microformats-discuss@microformats.org http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss From lfarzati at prima.com.ar Mon Mar 16 11:42:39 2009 From: lfarzati at prima.com.ar (Farzati, Luis) Date: Mon Mar 16 11:41:09 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] User comments question Message-ID: <22914EE5D39D1A4B9781D18B604C64780D7D361A@prima9.prima.local> Hi guys, I've written to Chris Messina but then thought: why I'm not using the mailing list? First of all, it's been many years from the last time I've used a mailing list, so be tolerant with me please :) I'm working on a REST service as part of our internal framework, intended to manage user comments for all the contents in our websites. With a bit of research in microformats.org, I've found that several proposals are being developed, but none yet confirmed. Of those, I like Atom Threading Extension the most, but it seems a bit complex for what I need. I think we should use XOXO that is more straightforward. hReview could make it too, as it's all about (shorter) reviews... What do you think? Comments should have author+date+comment, with the possibility to be threaded. But the real question is this: none of the proposals (from what I've read) mentions comment moderation or flagging. Are you working on this aspect? Maybe you could give me a hint? hReview has tags, which could be useful for this but I think it that would be a bit of a 'hack', right? I'd be really glad to hear any suggestions. Thank you very much! Kind regards, Luis From leoboiko at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 09:58:21 2009 From: leoboiko at gmail.com (Leonardo Boiko) Date: Wed Mar 18 09:58:26 2009 Subject: [uf-discuss] xmdp profiles & wiki 2 Message-ID: <3756413b0903181058r7fbb5b9eq47ade9931dde7b7d@mail.gmail.com> I could write this on wiki-2-issues, but since I never contributed anything I thought I might be missing something obvious and figured it would be better to email first. hcalendar's xmdp profile url is given as http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-profile ; it is currently garbled. I also noticed rel-tag doesn't have an xmdp url; its profile is instead given as quoted html in its main page. I figured I'd write /wiki/rel-tag-profile and fix hcalendar-profile, but I can't seem to find a way to write raw html to the wiki. And one needs to set specific class attributes for xmdp? hcalendar-profile just 
    s everything; I don't think that's a valid
xmdp profile?
-- 
Leonardo Boiko
http://namakajiri.net

From burcu at keyprints.org  Sat Mar 21 14:38:10 2009
From: burcu at keyprints.org (Burcu Dogan)
Date: Sat Mar 21 14:38:14 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
Message-ID: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,
Would it be illegal to use a geo inside of adr specifaction, such as:


  CA,
  US
  
    37.14814,
    -119.644249
  


Yes, I understand the fact that California is a polygon but I am
landing you a single point ? loss of semantics =( Then, what about
extending geo to represent multiple  couples to stand for
polygons and lines as well as points?

Thanks,
Burcu Dogan
--
http://blog.burcudogan.com
AIM: brcdogan
Twitter: http://twitter.com/thejbf

From brian.suda at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 04:28:20 2009
From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda)
Date: Sun Mar 22 04:28:24 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 10:38 PM, Burcu Dogan  wrote:
> Hello all,
> Would it be illegal to use a geo inside of adr specifaction, ...

--- you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
the semantics make sense. You can also out an ADR inside a GEO, then
you are avoiding more of the polygon versus point debate. The address
is a more specific GEO point than just the City/State/Country.

But overall, yes you can nest a GEO in an ADR.

-brian

-- 
brian suda
http://suda.co.uk
From danbri at danbri.org  Sun Mar 22 04:45:52 2009
From: danbri at danbri.org (Dan Brickley)
Date: Sun Mar 22 04:45:57 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
	<21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>

On 22/3/09 13:28, Brian Suda wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 10:38 PM, Burcu Dogan  wrote:
>> Hello all,
>> Would it be illegal to use a geo inside of adr specifaction, ...
>
> --- you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
> the semantics make sense.

...make sense given the base semantics of the microformats being used, 
or is it ok to have additional local markup hints linking the outer to 
the inner markup, even if generic parsers won't understand it?

cheers,

Dan
From brian.suda at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 05:11:50 2009
From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda)
Date: Sun Mar 22 05:11:55 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
	<21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>
	<49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>
Message-ID: <21e770780903220611t4ffceaaduc9701bdd61172c08@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Dan Brickley  wrote:
>> --- you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
>> the semantics make sense.
>
> ...make sense given the base semantics of the microformats being used, ...

--- i was referring to the semantics of the formats being combined.
Wrapping GEO around a recipe doesn't make much semantic sense to me
(maybe someone could argue a case for it).

> ... or is it ok to have additional local markup hints linking the outer to the inner
> markup, even if generic parsers won't understand it?

--- could you give an example of what you mean here?

-brian

-- 
brian suda
http://suda.co.uk
From danbri at danbri.org  Sun Mar 22 05:18:30 2009
From: danbri at danbri.org (Dan Brickley)
Date: Sun Mar 22 05:18:39 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <21e770780903220611t4ffceaaduc9701bdd61172c08@mail.gmail.com>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>	<21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>	<49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>
	<21e770780903220611t4ffceaaduc9701bdd61172c08@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49C63AA6.9030001@danbri.org>

On 22/3/09 14:11, Brian Suda wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Dan Brickley  wrote:
>>> --- you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
>>> the semantics make sense.
>> ...make sense given the base semantics of the microformats being used, ...
>
> --- i was referring to the semantics of the formats being combined.
> Wrapping GEO around a recipe doesn't make much semantic sense to me
> (maybe someone could argue a case for it).
>
>> ... or is it ok to have additional local markup hints linking the outer to the inner
>> markup, even if generic parsers won't understand it?
>
> --- could you give an example of what you mean here?

You just did :)

Putting a geo around a recipe, if one wanted to say the recipe was 
typical of the locality...

Dan
From burcu at keyprints.org  Sun Mar 22 08:25:12 2009
From: burcu at keyprints.org (Burcu Dogan)
Date: Sun Mar 22 08:33:29 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <49C63AA6.9030001@danbri.org>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
	<21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>
	<49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>
	<21e770780903220611t4ffceaaduc9701bdd61172c08@mail.gmail.com>
	<49C63AA6.9030001@danbri.org>
Message-ID: <64e0f12c0903220925g689f32f0he9550ae4ed488bee@mail.gmail.com>

>>> you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
the semantics make sense. You can also out an ADR inside a GEO, then
you are avoiding more of the polygon versus point debate. The address
is a more specific GEO point than just the City/State/Country.

Then, why dont adr have an optional geo field? OK, it is possible to geocode an
an existing address but wouldnt it provide a better interaction in the machine
world to embed the location info as coordinates as well. Since many of
the geocoders
stand on statistical methods, this may even be beneficial to take this
technology one step further.

Burcu,
http://blog.burcudogan.com

On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 3:18 PM, Dan Brickley  wrote:
> On 22/3/09 14:11, Brian Suda wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Dan Brickley ?wrote:
>>>>
>>>> --- you are free to nest microformats within one another, as long as
>>>> the semantics make sense.
>>>
>>> ...make sense given the base semantics of the microformats being used,
>>> ...
>>
>> --- i was referring to the semantics of the formats being combined.
>> Wrapping GEO around a recipe doesn't make much semantic sense to me
>> (maybe someone could argue a case for it).
>>
>>> ... or is it ok to have additional local markup hints linking the outer
>>> to the inner
>>> markup, even if generic parsers won't understand it?
>>
>> --- could you give an example of what you mean here?
>
> You just did :)
>
> Putting a geo around a recipe, if one wanted to say the recipe was typical
> of the locality...
>
> Dan
> _______________________________________________
> microformats-discuss mailing list
> microformats-discuss@microformats.org
> http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microformats-discuss
>



-- 
http://blog.burcudogan.com
AIM: brcdogan
Twitter: http://twitter.com/thejbf

From brian.suda at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 00:45:51 2009
From: brian.suda at gmail.com (Brian Suda)
Date: Mon Mar 23 00:45:58 2009
Subject: [uf-discuss] Using geo and adr together?
In-Reply-To: <64e0f12c0903220925g689f32f0he9550ae4ed488bee@mail.gmail.com>
References: <64e0f12c0903211538l6edff080ie423d6284a1ffd06@mail.gmail.com>
	<21e770780903220528q3230810ap1820b050d00f4673@mail.gmail.com>
	<49C63300.9030504@danbri.org>
	<21e770780903220611t4ffceaaduc9701bdd61172c08@mail.gmail.com>
	<49C63AA6.9030001@danbri.org>
	<64e0f12c0903220925g689f32f0he9550ae4ed488bee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <21e770780903230145h10022045rf62db06559a8c186@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 4:25 PM, Burcu Dogan  wrote:
> Then, why dont adr have an optional geo field? OK, it is possible to geocode an
> an existing address but wouldnt it provide a better interaction in the machine
> world to embed the location info as coordinates as well. Since many of
> the geocoders
> stand on statistical methods, this may even be beneficial to take this
> technology one step further.

--- Part of this comes from the vCard spec. In ADR in vCard, it is a
semicolon separated list of things like "street name", "Region",
"Locality", etc. Geo is NOT one of those separated values. GEO is a
separate value-key pair. So to stay consistent, GEO is not an optional
child of ADR, but its own entity.

There have also been some examples of GEO points that are NOT
addresses. Such as waypoints on a hiking trail, or the Apollo
splash-down site in the middle of the ocean. Neither of these are
really children of an ADR. So GEO was keep separate, but it just
happens to be closely related to ADR although it can refer to more
than just addresses.

I hope that answers your question.

-brian


-- 
brian suda
http://suda.co.uk