[uf-new] hAudio - audio-album and audio-podcast

Manu Sporny msporny at digitalbazaar.com
Fri Jun 1 22:59:40 PDT 2007

Joe Andrieu wrote:
> However, your point is correct. The current list of examples are all built 
> around albums and playlists. Most likely because that's pretty much
> what you restricted it to with the templates. No offense intended,
> but it's a pretty strong opening constraint at the top of the
> wiki page.

The templates were only created after analyzing 30-50 of the sites.
Items were added to the templates as needed, for example:

Audio Lunch Box has 'price in credits' as a part of the audio-related
information displayed on the page. Note that this value isn't in the
templates. The templates were only finalized after we finished analysis
of over 110 audio websites. Martin, Alexandre and I did the data
collection and analysis - we all knew that collecting data on each page
was free form.

We started with a list of 110 URLs and the patterns emerged from there -
not the other way around. Please don't assume the data was collected in
a certain way, nor assume contributions happened in a certain way. We
keep a close watch on contributions to that page and start a dialogue on
the proper way to collect data with anybody that modifies the page. This
includes free-form data gathering - the template is there only to help
the person that is gathering the data.

> Rather than jump in and violate that structure, I've not added 
> the playlist examples above to the wiki yet.

Please do add any examples that you want to... I can double check to
make sure that our analysis software won't barf on your input. You can
use whatever terms that you want to describe the information on the
page. Please, please, please help us gather examples...

> However, I do believe it is the simplest, most atomic
> problem we could start with. And therefore, probably our 
> best chance for getting traction.  The current hAudio
> proposal says "Defining parts of an hAudio will not be
> complete without a complete grouping draft/specification."
> That comes across as implying a much more complicated
> hAudio than the schema and your most recent comments suggests.

What we're suggesting is a very simple addition to hAudio. This is the
same exact solution that was devised for hAtom... you should take some
time and read up on the 'hfeed' property.


What we're talking about adding is 'album'.

>> What is your definition for a playlist? I think we have 
>> different definitions. Do you mean "A list of playable audio 
>> objects."?
> That's a really good question. I mean a list of audio tracks...

We've already had the playlist discussion on this list:


A playlist is hAudio + XOXO - simple as that.

> In my conception:
> . Album: playlist(s) + meta-data (including cover-art, etc.)

Album: 'album' property + 'track' property + hAudio

> . Playlist: track(s) + meta-data

Playlist: XOXO + hAudio

> . Track: option audiofile(s), each the same "audio" in 
> different formats or from different distribution points + meta-data

No need for this complexity - this case is covered in the Album example

> . Podcast: playlist(s) + meta-data; although I think 
> 80/20 suggests podcasts are usually a single track, single audiofile

No need for this complexity yet, or if we want to do this, it would be
mirrored directly from Album:

Album: 'podcast' property + XOXO + hAudio

> . Audiofile: a specific downloadable media file that contains 
> audio + meta-data.

We've already discussed this concept on the mailing list:


> So, I'm good with focusing current efforts on the simplest case.

Good, we have agreement on principal - however, I think the "simplest
case" that we're outlining is far more simple than you think it is.

Here is a complete example of what we're talking about:

<div class="halbum">
 <div class="summary">
  <div class="haudio">
   <span class="title">Black Horse and The Cherry Tree</span> by
   <span class="collaborator hcard fn">KT Tunstall</span>
 <ol class="xoxo">
   <div class="track">
    <div class="haudio">
     <span class="fn">Black Horse & The Cherry Tree</span>
   <div class="track">
    <div class="haudio">
     <span class="fn">One Day [Live]</span>

It's simple design, readable, easy to author, contains a "playlist",
doesn't have any scary dot-notation, and is semantically rich.

-- manu

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