opening-hours-brainstorming - Revision history

Btrem: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */ Adds indentation to make thread easier to follow.

2021-02-27T21:14:12Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours: Adds indentation to make thread easier to follow.

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:14, 27 February 2021
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	Some thoughts:		Some thoughts:

	Using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)		* Using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
			** There are two GitHub issues (https://github.com/microformats/h-feed/issues/3 and https://github.com/microformats/h-entry/issues/16) arguing against me and for broadening [[h-feed]]'s use. So that might be the way to go. I still think we need a way to determine that the feed specifies opening hours, perhaps with a p-children-type for h-feed. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 20:11, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	~~There are GitHub issues arguing against me and for broadening [[h-feed]]'s use:~~		* I don't understand how the <code>id</code> attributes and url fragment urls are supposed to work. The fragment urls link to their own p containers. Is that supposed to convey that this is a repeating event? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
	* ~~https://github.com/microformats/h-feed/issues/3~~
	* https://github.com/microformats/h-entry/issues/16
	So that might be the way to go. I still think we need a way to determine that the feed specifies opening hours, perhaps with a p-children-type for h-feed. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 20:11, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	I don't understand how the <code>id</code> attributes and url fragment urls are supposed to work. The fragment urls link to their own p containers. Is that supposed to convey that this is a repeating event? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	=== simple class proposal ===		=== simple class proposal ===

Btrem: /* calendar of unnamed events */ Asking for use case for day of week with time.

2021-02-27T21:03:39Z

calendar of unnamed events: Asking for use case for day of week with time.

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:03, 27 February 2021
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	** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST		** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST
	** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)		** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
			*** What is the use case for "'day-of-week relative' time"? I assume this is something different to a specific date, so not Saturday 2021-02-27T13:00. The problem is html5's datetime attribute doesn't have a way to specify day of week. Such things are in various iso specs, but those conventions would have to be ported to html5. That's obviously outside the scope of microformats. If you have details about what came up in chat, I'd be curious to see the problem. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 21:03, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

	==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====		==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====

GRegorLove: /* brainstorming */ merge from /operating-hours per todo list

2021-02-24T01:51:44Z

brainstorming: merge from /operating-hours per todo list

@@ Line 68: / Line 68: @@
 I don't see anything in [https://www.iso.org/iso-8601-date-and-time-format.html ISO 8601] to specify days of the week. [[User:Btrem|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem|talk]]) 17:02, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 </div>
 == related ==

GRegorLove: /* calendar of unnamed events */ comment, indent

2021-02-23T20:58:50Z

calendar of unnamed events: comment, indent

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:58, 23 February 2021
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	* I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)		* I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
	* My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST		** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST
			** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

	==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====		==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====

Btrem: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */ Adds links to GitHub issues suggesting broader use of h-feed.

2021-02-21T20:11:04Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours: Adds links to GitHub issues suggesting broader use of h-feed.

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:11, 21 February 2021
Line 34:		Line 34:
	Some thoughts:		Some thoughts:

	* using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)		Using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
	* I don't understand how the <code>id</code> attributes and url fragment urls are supposed to work. The fragment urls link to their own p containers. Is that supposed to convey that this is a repeating event? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
			There are GitHub issues arguing against me and for broadening [[h-feed]]'s use:
			* https://github.com/microformats/h-feed/issues/3
			* https://github.com/microformats/h-entry/issues/16
			So that might be the way to go. I still think we need a way to determine that the feed specifies opening hours, perhaps with a p-children-type for h-feed. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 20:11, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

			I don't understand how the <code>id</code> attributes and url fragment urls are supposed to work. The fragment urls link to their own p containers. Is that supposed to convey that this is a repeating event? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	=== simple class proposal ===		=== simple class proposal ===

Btrem: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */ Asks for clarification of fragment url usage.

2021-02-21T18:27:26Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours: Asks for clarification of fragment url usage.

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:27, 21 February 2021
Line 35:		Line 35:

	* using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)		* using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
			* I don't understand how the <code>id</code> attributes and url fragment urls are supposed to work. The fragment urls link to their own p containers. Is that supposed to convey that this is a repeating event? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	=== simple class proposal ===		=== simple class proposal ===

Btrem: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */ Suggests a new h-event collection container.

2021-02-21T18:15:55Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours: Suggests a new h-event collection container.

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:15, 21 February 2021
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	</aside>		</aside>
	</pre>		</pre>

			Some thoughts:

			* using `h-feed` for a feed of events raises some issues: [[h-feed]] is explicitly described as "a stream or feed of h-entry posts". I suppose that could be changed, but it requires changing a fairly stable spec. And it means that authors who are new to microformats will have to learn how to distinguish them. I think a new type should be used to avoid confusion. Note that [[hCalendar]] was created as a 1:1 html version of iCalendar, a ''collection'' of events; microformats2's [[h-event]] is for a ''single'' event. If we go with a feed of events, we should revive the iCalendar idea. We need to give it a name that makes it clear it's a feed of events. Perhaps '''h-feed-events'''? [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 18:15, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

	=== simple class proposal ===		=== simple class proposal ===

Jacky: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */ correct timestamsp

2021-02-20T02:54:38Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours: correct timestamsp

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:54, 20 February 2021
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	<h2 class="p-name">Hours</h2>		<h2 class="p-name">Hours</h2>
	<p class="h-event" id="Monday">Closed on <a href="#Monday" class="u-url p-name">Mondays</a>.</p>		<p class="h-event" id="Monday">Closed on <a href="#Monday" class="u-url p-name">Mondays</a>.</p>
	<p class="h-event" id="Tuesday">Open on <a href="#Tuesday" class="u-url p-name">Tuesdays</a> from <time class="dt-start" datetime="9:~~00AM~~">9 AM</time> to <time class="dt-end" datetime="6:~~00PM~~">6 PM</time>.</p>		<p class="h-event" id="Tuesday">Open on <a href="#Tuesday" class="u-url p-name">Tuesdays</a> from <time class="dt-start" datetime="09:00:00">9 AM</time> to <time class="dt-end" datetime="18:00:00">6 PM</time>.</p>
	</aside>		</aside>
	</pre>		</pre>

Jacky: /* Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours */

2021-02-20T02:53:53Z

Jacky's Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:53, 20 February 2021
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	<pre>		<pre>
	<aside class="h-feed">		<aside class="h-feed">
	<h2 class="p-name>Hours</h2>		<h2 class="p-name">Hours</h2>
	<p class="h-event" id="Monday">Closed on <a href="#Monday" class="u-url p-name">Mondays</a>.</p>		<p class="h-event" id="Monday">Closed on <a href="#Monday" class="u-url p-name">Mondays</a>.</p>
	<p class="h-event" id="Tuesday"><a href="#Tuesday" class="u-url p-name">~~Tuesday~~</a> from <time class="dt-start" datetime="9:00AM">9 AM</time> to <time class="dt-end" datetime="6:00PM">6 PM</time>.</p>		<p class="h-event" id="Tuesday">Open on <a href="#Tuesday" class="u-url p-name">Tuesdays</a> from <time class="dt-start" datetime="9:00AM">9 AM</time> to <time class="dt-end" datetime="6:00PM">6 PM</time>.</p>
	</aside>		</aside>
	</pre>		</pre>

Jacky: /* calendar of unnamed events */ add bullet points

2021-02-20T02:52:41Z

calendar of unnamed events: add bullet points

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:52, 20 February 2021
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	As suggested by jacky in [[irc]], a calendar of unnamed events (using [[h-event]]), perhaps nested in the venue's [[h-card]], maybe sufficient to imply/convey opening hours for those days.		As suggested by jacky in [[irc]], a calendar of unnamed events (using [[h-event]]), perhaps nested in the venue's [[h-card]], maybe sufficient to imply/convey opening hours for those days.

	I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)		* I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
			* My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST
	My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST

	==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====		==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:03, 27 February 2021
Line 14:		Line 14:
	** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST		** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST
	** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)		** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
			*** What is the use case for "'day-of-week relative' time"? I assume this is something different to a specific date, so not Saturday 2021-02-27T13:00. The problem is html5's datetime attribute doesn't have a way to specify day of week. Such things are in various iso specs, but those conventions would have to be ported to html5. That's obviously outside the scope of microformats. If you have details about what came up in chat, I'd be curious to see the problem. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 21:03, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

	==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====		==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:58, 23 February 2021
Line 12:		Line 12:

	* I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)		* I think opening hours is worth its own type. `h-x-opening-hours` or some such thing. With a single property that is a nested h-event. [[User:Btrem\|Btrem]] ([[User talk:Btrem\|talk]]) 02:38, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
	* My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST		** My only hesistation against making a new type is that the 'specifics' are things that can be defined by a machine (when to start, when to end) and everything else is human-specific (and thus a rendering layer). [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]] 18:41, 20 Feb 2021 PST
			** A new microformat (h-*) feels like it's taking on too big of a problem when we can probably find smaller problems to solve first (per [[process\|The microformats process]]). A problem I think I saw come up in chat is how to represent the time for a day of the week. Maybe we could work on how to represent a "day-of-week relative" time with existing properties in an h-event. [[User:GRegorLove\|gRegor]] ([[User talk:GRegorLove\|talk]]) 20:58, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

	==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====		==== [[User:Jacky\|Jacky]]'s Idea for Rendering a Week of Hours ====