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<h1>Recipe Brainstorming</h1>
Towards a [[recipe|Recipe]] microformat.  Please read the [[process]] before editing this page.


Towards a [[recipe|Recipe]] microformat.  Please read the [[process]] before editing this page.




<div id="Format-In-Progress">
<div id="Format-In-Progress">
==format-in-progress - september 2007==
==format-in-progress - #1 - september 2007==
</div>
</div>
This format-in-progress follows the restarting of Recipe development by [[User:Phae|Frances Berriman]] on 25th September 2007. Note that this Format-In-Progress section is intended to be edited to reflect the discussion that occurs on the microformats-new list, rather than being a free-form playground for schema. This documentation was produced by [[User:BenWard|Ben Ward]] and [[User:Phae|Frances Berriman]].
; Editor
: [[User:Phae|Frances Berriman]] (BBC)
===Introduction===
Recipe is based on [[recipe-examples|examples]] and fields in [[recipe-formats|existing formats]].
The recipe microformat is designed for the mark-up of instructions for creating meals, drinks or food-based items. 
===Root Class Name===
To be decided. Likely ‘hrecipe’.
===Property List===
Class names <code>author</code> and <code>published</code> are taken from [[hAtom]], <code>photo</code> used from [[hCard]] and <code>item</code> from [[measure]].
* Title. <code>recipe-title</code>. required. text.
* Summary. <code>recipe-summary</code>. optional. text.
* Author. <code>author</code>. optional. [[hcard]].
* Date published. <code>published</code>. optional. [[datetime-design-pattern]].
* Photo(s). <code>photo</code>. optional. img or url.
* Ingredient(s). <code>ingredient</code>. 1 or more required.
** Quantity. <code>quantity</code>. optional. text, optionally [[measure]].
** Item. <code>item</code>. required. text.
** Note. <code>note</code>. optional. text.
** Optionality. <code>optional</code>. optional. text. Its absence should imply that the ingredient is required.
* Method. <code>method</code>. required. text with optional valid HTML markup.
* Yield. <code>yield</code>. optional. text.
* Preparation time. <code>preparation-time</code>. optional. (see [[ISO-31-1]] duration brainstorming)
* Tags. optional. [[rel-tag]].
* License. optional. [[rel-license]].
===Field Details===
'''Title''': The title of the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>recipe-title</code>.
* A Recipe {{must}} have a <code>recipe-title</code>
'''Summary''': The summary provides a short introduction or an accompanying statement about the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>recipe-summary</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} have a <code>recipe-summary</code>.
'''Author''': Author the person who authored the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>author</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include an <code>author</code>.
* The contents of the element {{must}} include a valid [[hCard]].
'''Date published''': The date the recipe was published.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>published</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>published</code> date.
* {{should}} (?) use the [[datetime-design-pattern]] to encode the published datetime.
'''Photo''': Accompanying image.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>photo</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include one or more photo elements.
* The element {{should}} use an <code><img></code> element.
* The element {{may}} use any other element that contains a URL, such as <code><a></code> or <code><object></code>, but it is not recommended.
'''Ingredient''': Describes an ingredient used in the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>ingredient</code>.
* A Recipe {{must}} have one or more <code>ingredient</code>s.
* The element {{must}} include the field item.
* The element {{may}} include <code>quantity</code>, <code>note</code> and/or <code>optionality</code>.
'''Quantity''': The quantity of an ingredient needed for the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>quantity</code>.
* An ingredient {{may}} specify the <code>quantity</code>.
'''Item''': Specifies the name of the ingredient.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>item</code>.
* An ingredient {{must}} specify the <code>item</code>.
'''Note''': A note concerning one of the ingredients.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>note</code>.
* An ingredient {{may}} include a <code>note</code>.
'''Optionality''': States that an ingredient is optional to the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>optionality</code>.
* The <code>optionality</code> of an <code>ingredient</code> {{may}} be specified.
* The absence of the element implies that the ingredient is required.
'''Method''': The method of the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>method</code>.
* A Recipe {{must}} include a <code>method</code>.
* The field {{may}} include valid HTML markup (e.g. paragraphs).
'''Yield''': Specifies the quantity produced by the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>yield</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>yield</code>.


For the sake of clarity the format-in-progress from september 2007 was moved to  [[recipe-brainstorming-archive]]. [[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 14:12, 11. Nov 2008 (CET)


<div id="Format-In-Progress-10-2008">
<div id="Format-In-Progress-10-2008">
==format-in-progress - #2 - october 2008==
==format-in-progress - #2 - october 2008==
</div>
</div>
This second Format-In-Progress reflects the discussions following the first one from september 2007 (see above). It's not an entirely new format but rather an evolution and about 95% the same as the first one. Most important changes are the adition of a <code>nutrition</code> element , a <code>preparation-time-note</code> element and the optionality of <code>method</code>. To improve readability also parts that haven't changed are repeated, while changes are marked with '''<#2''' and commented.
Please note again that Format-In-Progress sections are intended to be edited to reflect the discussion that occurs on the microformats-new list, rather than being a free-form playground for schema. This Format-In-Progress was produced by [[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:29, 15. Oct 2008 (CET)
===Introduction===
Recipe is based on [[recipe-examples|examples]] and fields in [[recipe-formats|existing formats]].
The recipe microformat is designed for the mark-up of instructions for creating meals, drinks or food-based items. 
===Root Class Name===
To be decided. Likely ‘hrecipe’.
===Property List===
Class names <code>author</code> and <code>published</code> are taken from [[hAtom]], <code>photo</code> used from [[hCard]] and <code>item</code> from [[measure]].
* Title. <code>recipe-title</code>. required. text.
* Summary. <code>recipe-summary</code>. optional. text.
* Author. <code>author</code>. optional. [[hcard]].
* Date published. <code>published</code>. optional. [[datetime-design-pattern]].
* Photo(s). <code>photo</code>. optional. img or url.
* Ingredient(s). <code>ingredient</code>. 1 or more required.
** Quantity. <code>quantity</code>. optional. text, optionally [[measure]].
** Item. <code>item</code>. required. text.
** Note. <code>note</code>. optional. text.
** '''<#2''' deleted Optionality
* Method. <code>method</code>. optional. text with optional valid HTML markup. '''<#2''' changed to optional
* Yield. <code>yield</code>. optional. text.
* Preparation time. <code>preparation-time</code>. 1 or more, optional. (see [[ISO-31-1]] duration brainstorming) '''<#2''' changed to optionally multiple instances
** Preparation time note. <code>preparation-time-note</code>. optional. text '''<#2''' added
* Tags. optional. [[rel-tag]].
* Nutrition<code>nutrition</code>. optional. Joule [[measure] '''<#2''' added, see Field Details below for a longer version
* License. optional. [[rel-license]].
===Field Details===
'''Title''': The title of the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>recipe-title</code>.
* A Recipe {{must}} have a <code>recipe-title</code>
'''Summary''': The summary provides a short introduction or an accompanying statement about the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>recipe-summary</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} have a <code>recipe-summary</code>.
'''Author''': Author the person who authored the recipe.
* The element is identified by class name <code>author</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include an <code>author</code>.
* The contents of the element {{must}} include a valid [[hCard]].
'''Date published''': The date the recipe was published.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>published</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>published</code> date.
* {{should}} (?) use the [[datetime-design-pattern]] to encode the published datetime.
'''Photo''': Accompanying image.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>photo</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include one or more photo elements.
* The element {{should}} use an <code><img></code> element.
* The element {{may}} use any other element that contains a URL, such as <code><a></code> or <code><object></code>, but it is not recommended.
'''Ingredient''': Describes an ingredient used in the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>ingredient</code>.
* A Recipe {{must}} have one or more <code>ingredient</code>s.
* The element {{must}} include the <code>field</code> item.
* The element {{may}} include <code>quantity</code> and/or <code>note</code>.
'''Quantity''': The quantity of an ingredient needed for the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>quantity</code>.
* An ingredient {{may}} specify the <code>quantity</code>.
'''Item''': Specifies the name of the ingredient.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>item</code>.
* An ingredient {{must}} specify the <code>item</code>.
'''Note''': A note concerning one of the ingredients.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>note</code>.
* An ingredient {{may}} include a <code>note</code>.
* '''<#2''' '''Optionality''' has been deleted since it's rarely needed and can be stated within a <code>note</code>
'''Method''': The method of the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>method</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>method</code>.
* The field {{may}} include valid HTML markup (e.g. paragraphs).
* '''<#2''' <code>method</code> is now optional since there are recipes like salads or shakes that don't need a method
'''Yield''': Specifies the quantity produced by the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>yield</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>yield</code>.
'''Preparation Time''': The time it takes to prepare the meal described by the recipe.
* The element is identified by the class name <code>preparation-time</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include one or more <code>preparation-time</code>s.
* '''<#2''' Since some recipes need not only time for preparation, but also considerable time for e.g. boiling, waiting for the dough to rise etc, this element may be used multiple times.
'''Preparation Time Note''':  '''<#2''' added. Specifies the purpose of a Preparation Time .
* The element is identified by the class name <code>preparation-time-note</code>.
* A Preparation Time {{may}} include a <code>preparation-time-note</code>.
* An optional note may be added to each of multiple intervals to specify their respective purpose.
'''Nutrition''': '''<#2''' added to optionally provide nutritional information.
* The element is identified by class name <code>nutrition</code>.
* A Recipe {{may}} include a <code>nutrition</code> element.
* This simple version would just add Joules since this is the most used and asked for information.
* A more elaborate version would add information for fat, proteins, carbohydrates and dietary fiber - but this may already be out of the 80/20 range. Of course a lot more nutritional values would be available but these seem definitely outside 80/20.
** Nutrition<code>nutrition</code>. optional
*** Energy. <code>energy</code>. optional. Joule [[measure]]
*** Fat. <code>fat</code>. optional. gram [[measure]]
*** Protein. <code>protein</code>. optional. gram [[measure]]
*** Carbohydrates. <code>carbohydrates</code>. optional. gram [[measure]]
*** Dietary fiber. <code>dietary fiber</code>. optional. gram [[measure]]


Also the format-in-progress from october  2008 has been moved to  [[recipe-brainstorming-archive]]. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 12:49, 9 July 2009 (UTC)


==brainstorming==
==brainstorming==
===RecipeML-based Brainstorm===
===RecipeML-based Brainstorm===
'''NOTE: Brainstorms should be based on implied schema of examples, not on explicit schema of other formats.  The only exceptions where this appears to have been ok (perhaps I got lucky) was with hCard (based on vCard) and hCalendar (based on iCalendar), but even in those cases, experience has shown that there are several properties in each that in practice have not shown much if any use, therefore indicating that the microformats were/are bigger than they need(ed) to be.''' [[User:Tantek|Tantek]] 23:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
Excerpted from [http://conoroneill.com/2006/03/21/what-if-i-suggest-a-structured-recipe-format-and-you-critique-it/ Conor Bandon's Blog entry] and derived from The RecipeML Spec:
Excerpted from [http://conoroneill.com/2006/03/21/what-if-i-suggest-a-structured-recipe-format-and-you-critique-it/ Conor Bandon's Blog entry] and derived from The RecipeML Spec:
*Recipe_Title
*Recipe_Title
Line 226: Line 25:
*Ingredients (each one a separate "item" rather than block text with count/amount/range/unit broken out too)
*Ingredients (each one a separate "item" rather than block text with count/amount/range/unit broken out too)
**Some (e.g. meats, vegetables) could optionally be marked up with (elements of) the proposed [[species]] microformat. [[User:AndyMabbett|Andy Mabbett]] 06:41, 16 Nov 2006 (PST)
**Some (e.g. meats, vegetables) could optionally be marked up with (elements of) the proposed [[species]] microformat. [[User:AndyMabbett|Andy Mabbett]] 06:41, 16 Nov 2006 (PST)
*** None of the [[recipe-examples]] show references to species names, therefore there is no empirical justification for inclusion of such detail in the microformat. [[User:Tantek|Tantek]] 23:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
**** The vast majority of recipes reference a species of plant or animal (e.g. "chicken", "carrot"). Binomial/trinomial names are pretty much never seen of course, but the current species proposal allows for vernacular (common) names to be marked up, so it is not an especially odd suggestion to define a pattern for marking up species within ingredients. [[User:TobyInk|TobyInk]] 20:11, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
** Ingredient importance (e.g. Main, Required, Optional) should be listed as an attribute of each entry. [[User:AlexanderShusta|α]]
** Ingredient importance (e.g. Main, Required, Optional) should be listed as an attribute of each entry. [[User:AlexanderShusta|α]]
**Units need separate microformat: see [[measure]]  
**Units need separate microformat: see [[measure]]  
Line 304: Line 105:
*Menus - With the addition of a "price" field, and perhaps one or two others, and again making "method" optional, this microformat can also be used for menus. See [[recipe-examples#Menus|menu examples]]. [[User:AndyMabbett|Andy Mabbett]] 02:39, 19 Feb 2008 (PST)
*Menus - With the addition of a "price" field, and perhaps one or two others, and again making "method" optional, this microformat can also be used for menus. See [[recipe-examples#Menus|menu examples]]. [[User:AndyMabbett|Andy Mabbett]] 02:39, 19 Feb 2008 (PST)
**I would consider this out of scope (which is to produce an as-simple-as-possible microformat "for the mark-up of instructions for creating meals, drinks or food-based items" - [[recipe-brainstorming#Introduction | introduction]]) --[[User:Yde|Yde]] 13:39, 23 Apr 2008 (PDT)
**I would consider this out of scope (which is to produce an as-simple-as-possible microformat "for the mark-up of instructions for creating meals, drinks or food-based items" - [[recipe-brainstorming#Introduction | introduction]]) --[[User:Yde|Yde]] 13:39, 23 Apr 2008 (PDT)
===Calories===
per serving. May be part of the [[measure]] microformat in future.
* +1. Nutritional information is quite important for a lot of people and is inside the 80/20. It should be included as an optional element. The problems are: which nutritional information exactly? A common denominator is calories, proteins, carbohydrates and fat. That's also what european law demands as information on packaged food. Most sites that I visited only list calories as nutritional information (if any). Since Calories are a somehow superordinate concept for proteins, carbohydrates and fat that's fine. Allrecipes.com is quite extreme with a huge list of nutritional information - clearly outside 80/20 IMHO.  Another problem: although Calories are the most popular term, the measure is deprecated in favor of Joule. hMeasure too uses Joule. I'd therefor propose to add the ''optional'' element <code>nutrition</code> and subelements <code>calories</code>("mandatory") in Joule,<code>fat</code>("optional"), <code>protein</code>("optional"), <code>carbohydrates</code>("optional"), and <code>dietary fiber</code>("optional"), those all in grams. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:16, 01 Oct 2008 (CET), modified 09.Oct 2008 and 13.Oct 2008
** +1 for a <code>nutrition</code> element. However, I would like to change the subelement <code>calories</code> to <code>energy</code>, as that would allow using either calories or joules (using hMeausere) and it feels weird to state joule in an element called calories. --[[User:Yde|Yde]] 05:57, 11 Oct 2008 (PDT)
** I felt the same and <code>energy</code> is a good idea. However I think we should stay with Joules, since hMeasure doesn't include Calories and we don't want to get things too complicated.
*** hMeasure allows ''any'' units to be used. The [[measure#unit:_The_Unit_of_Measurement|<code>unit</code> property]] is defined as an opaque string. The draft spec does ''allow'' parsers to delve into this otherwise opaque string and assign meaning to it, and strongly suggests that any parsers which do this support all SI units and prefixes. However, it does not prevent authors from using non-SI units, such as calories. [[User:TobyInk|TobyInk]]
*** You're right. Still, wouldn't it make more sense to go for the standardized Joule instead of the deprecated and non-standardized Calories?
** But do we really decide for the multi-element proposal outlined above?  Or should we rather go for a simple and single <code>nutrition</code> element,  ''optional'', without subelements (and with hMeasure Joule)? I'm still undecided myself.  [[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 12:02, 13.Oct 2008 (CET)
===Note===
The 'note' property is only useful in some [http://microformats.org/discuss/mail/microformats-new/2008-June/001635.html rare cases] and might not fit the 80-20 rule.
* We might want to [[principles|start as simple as possible]] and leave this out for a future revision.
* People often put some of the very basic preparation steps into the ingredients list. For example, ingredients lists sometimes read like "one onion, finely chopped".
* +1. <code>note</code> should stay as an optional value. There are so many ways to define ingredients that it seems useful enough to fit into the 80/20. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:26, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)
===Optional===
Instead of <code>note</code> I'd rather remove the <code>optional</code> property. Information about the optionality of an ingredient can easily be added in the <code>note</code> field, e.g. together with suggestions for a possible replacement. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 12:59, 13.Oct 2008 (CET)
===Method===
For informally or concisely written recipes, the method is often left out. Could we either make this optional, or have an optimisation such that if the method is absent, the entire text of the recipe is taken to be the method. [[User:TobyInk|TobyInk]] 02:53, 15 Jul 2008 (PDT)
* e.g. salad, sandwich and smoothie recipes don't often require a method to be useful.
* +1 for making it optional. Although most recipes rely heavily on a method there are indeed those where it isn't necessary. If 80/20 does mean that easy or simple usecases should be facilitated it would be in line with the principal to make the method optional. And it wouldn't hurt anybody either. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:04, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)
* I don't know... Making the method optional would make "I like to eat cheese for supper" a technically valid recipe, but it provides no value as a recipe. In other words, I am concerned that this will lead to people using the format for things it was not intented for. I don't know if this will happen, but we need to take it into consideration. --[[User:Yde|Yde]] 06:17, 11 Oct 2008 (PDT)
* I think there's no technical way to prevent misuse (and no other way either ;-). --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 12:52, 13.Oct 2008 (CET)
===Preparation Time===
Make <code>preparation-time</code> plural and add an optional <code>preparation-time-note</code> element inline to preparation time
* <code>preparation-time</code> (optional, plural)
** <code>preparation-time-note</code> (optional, singular)
There are often times additional to the main preparation time i.e. the time the dough needs to rise. When scanning a recipe for
practicality - i.e. your guest are coming in 4 hours - this is a very important information. Allowing <code>preparation-time</code> to be used more than once per recipe and adding an optional <code>note</code> element would allow great flexibility in stating such details while staying simple. It could also be used to give times for different parts of a recipe like cake and topping or to differentiate times for preparation, waiting and cooking. --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:05, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)
* That's a good point. But how do we semantically connect the preparation time and a specific part of the recipe? --[[User:Yde|Yde]] 06:25, 11 Oct 2008 (PDT)
* In the absence of sections for ingredients or method steps I see no way to connect the preparation time and a specific part of the recipe in a standardized manner. But the same applies to ingredients and method steps. I guess a solution would need some quite involved sectioning constructs. In my feeling this is not such a big problem that it justifies further constructs. [[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 12:25, 13 Oct 2008 (CET)


===Quantity===
===Quantity===
Line 393: Line 160:
* Do we have <code>ingredients</code> (plural) as an element? Doesn't that open a whole can of list-issues? --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:37, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)
* Do we have <code>ingredients</code> (plural) as an element? Doesn't that open a whole can of list-issues? --[[User:ThomasLoertsch|ThomasLoertsch]] 15:37, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)


====Ingredient Item/Quantity====
=== Promoting hRecipe for use in Recipe Search Indexing ===
My company has an interest in the establishment and adoption of a recipe-based microformat in support of our goal to index recipe content for search.


[[User:TobyInk|TobyInk]] 03:42, 23 Mar 2008 (PDT):
We would like to promote a few [http://microformats.org/wiki/posh POSH] extensions to hRecipe that we think will be useful to the recipe-publishing community in support of our shared intention to promote hRecipe's adoption as a standard.


This idea's a bit more "out there" and probably needs a bit more work.
I have outlined these extensions (and our rationale) below and would like to ask the community for comment in advance of any publication. After comment, we will host a public page outlining the extensions which will refer to microformats.org as the authoritative source for hRecipe.


<pre><nowiki><li class="ingredient">3  eggs</li></nowiki></pre>
(My intent is also to share whatever data we collect on the adoption of hRecipe in the sites we index, which will include smaller blogger sites where we expect hRecipe will initially be most prevalent.)


(note the double-space between '3' and 'eggs') is treated as a shorthand for:
--[[User:DaveCorboy|DaveCorboy]] 03:43, 22 March 2010 (UTC)


<pre><nowiki><li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">3</span> <span class="item">eggs</span></li></nowiki></pre>
* We have now published the page I reference above [http://www.ziplist.com/recipe_microformat here]. --[[User:DaveCorboy|DaveCorboy]] 04:57, 4 April 2010 (UTC)


This is similar to N-optimisation in hCard, but uses a double space instead of a single space because the components (quantity, item) may themselves each contain spaces. With both of these optimisations in place, the sponge cake ingredient list can be written as concisely as:
==== Proposed Extensions ====
===== comment =====
* An inline comment for an ingredient within the recipe.
* Optional. Text. Limited to one '''comment''' per ingredient.
* ''Rationale: We have seen a number of examples in the wild of comments mixed in with ingredients. '''comment''' allows the expression of a standard ingredient list while also allowing for prose-style lists and additional commentary (e.g., substitutions) related to specific ingredients.''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<ul>
  <li class="ingredient">1 cup of walnuts or pecans
    <span class="comment">
      (Though I usually prefer pecans in most recipes, I like walnuts best in this.)
    </span>
  </li>
</ul>
</nowiki></pre>


<pre><nowiki><ul class="ingredients">
===== step =====
<li>3  eggs</li>
* The steps necessary to prepare the recipe.
<li>6 oz  self-raising flour</li>
* Optional. Text. No limit to the total number of '''step'''s per recipe. Use of step properties within an instructions block are optional, but recommended.
<li>6 oz  caster sugar</li>
* ''Rationale: The [http://www.cookingforengineers.com/recipe/33/Lemon-Bars Cooking for Engineers] website is an excellent real-world example of the many alternative recipe writing styles described in [http://www.anthus.com/Recipes/CompCook.html this paper]. hRecipe has reasonably [http://microformats.org/wiki/recipe-issues#closed_issues closed this as an immediate need], however we wish to try to accommodate this sort of prose-style recipes that do not have an explicit collection of steps.''
<li>6 oz  butter</li>
Example
<li>1 tsp  vanilla essence</li>
<pre><nowiki>
</ul></nowiki></pre>
<div class="instructions">
  <p>So before we get to the recipe, let me tell you a story about cranberries...</p>
  <p>
    Now, let's get to cooking! First, you will need to <span class="step">coarsely grind the cranberries. Fill your blender 2/3 full...</span>
    After you have done this, you will need to <span class="step">pour the blender contents into your strainer and let the liquid...</span>
  </p>
  <p>
    All this cooking reminds me of the apple farm where I grew up...
    Now that you know where apples come from, you will need to <span class="step">peel and dice the apples and add them to the drained cranberries.</span>
  </p>
</div>
</nowiki></pre>


Which (apart from the double spaces) is pretty close to how many people publish ingredients lists already. (Certainly close to how I do!)
===== preptime =====
* Time it takes for the preparation step of the recipe.
* Optional. Text or the property may be encoded using the [http://microformats.org/wiki/value-class-pattern value-class-pattern]. Limited to one '''preptime''' per recipe.  
* ''Rationale: We add '''preptime''' and '''cooktime''' to help publishers express these values explicitly and request only one '''duration''' property to express total time for the recipe.''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<h6>Preparation time: <span class="preptime">5 minutes</span></h6>
</nowiki></pre>


==== Alternative Ingredient Item/Quantity Optimisation ====
===== cooktime =====
* Time it takes for the cooking step of the recipe.
* Optional. Text or the property may be encoded using the [http://microformats.org/wiki/value-class-pattern value-class-pattern]. Limited to one '''cooktime''' per recipe.
* ''Rationale: We add '''preptime''' and '''cooktime''' to help publishers express these values explicitly and request only one '''duration''' property to express total time for the recipe.''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<h6>Cooking time: <span class="cooktime">25 minutes</span></h6>
</nowiki></pre>


[[User:TobyInk|TobyInk]] 02:02, 24 Mar 2008 (PDT): Perhaps a better solution than the double spacing...
===== tag =====
* One or more tags (cuisine, keyword, etc.) for the recipe.
* Optional. No limit to number of '''tag'''  properties per recipe.
* ''Rationale: Our use of tagging is very different from the use-case of [http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-tag rel-tag] which requires a tagspace. In our use case, we need to allow users of the microformat the ability to associate descriptive words to a recipe, but cannot require they also construct a web infrastructure. This view is correctly rejected by the rel-tag issues reviewers citing large-scale sites such as Flickr and del.icio.us. Perhaps "tags" is simply the wrong term for us?''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<span class="tag">Salad</span>
<span class="tag">Fruit</span>
</nowiki></pre>


As above, but:
===== category =====
* Category of the recipe.
* Optional. Limited to one '''category''' per recipe.
* ''Rationale: While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the category of the recipe is often treated differently in published recipes and we'd like to try to promote it out of the tags.''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<span class="category">Side dish</span>
</nowiki></pre>


<pre><nowiki><ul class="ingredients">
===== difficulty =====
<li><var>3</var> eggs</li>
* Difficulty level of preparing the recipe.
<li><var>6 oz</var> self-raising flour</li>
* Optional. The value should be encoded as a fraction using the '''value-title''' class defined in the [http://microformats.org/wiki/value-class-pattern value-class-pattern]. Limited to one '''difficulty''' per recipe.
<li><var>6 oz</var> caster sugar</li>
* ''Rationale: While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the difficulty of the recipe is often expressed in published recipes as a specific ratio.''
<li><var>6 oz</var> butter</li>
Example
<li><var>1 tsp</var> vanilla essence</li>
<pre><nowiki>
</ul></nowiki></pre>
<span class="difficulty"><span class="value-title" title="1/3" />Easy</span>
</nowiki></pre>


Or is this stretching the meaning of &lt;var> too much?
===== rating =====
* Rating of the recipe.
* Optional. The value should be encoded as a fraction using the '''value-title''' class defined in the [http://microformats.org/wiki/value-class-pattern value-class-pattern]. Limited to one '''rating''' per recipe.
* ''While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the rating of the recipe is often expressed in published recipes as a specific ratio.''
Example
<pre><nowiki>
<span class="rating"><span class="value-title" title="4/5" /><img src="/images/4-out-of-5-stars.jpg" /></span>
</nowiki></pre>


==issues==
==issues==
Line 439: Line 269:
===Cognition===
===Cognition===
As of September 2008, [http://buzzword.org.uk/cognition/ Cognition] has experimental support for this format. ([http://buzzword.org.uk/cognition/uf-plus.html#hrecipe Details of support].) Recipes may be exported in [[recipe-formats#RecipeBook_XML|RecipeBook XML]] format or RDF.
As of September 2008, [http://buzzword.org.uk/cognition/ Cognition] has experimental support for this format. ([http://buzzword.org.uk/cognition/uf-plus.html#hrecipe Details of support].) Recipes may be exported in [[recipe-formats#RecipeBook_XML|RecipeBook XML]] format or RDF.
==examples in the wild==
'''Wild Mushroom, Pancetta & Truffle Risotto''' by Toby Inkster
* [http://tobyinkster.co.uk/blog/2008/10/23/mushroom-risotto/ Marked up as hRecipe] using the September 2007 draft format
* [http://srv.buzzword.org.uk/recipebook/tobyinkster.co.uk/blog/2008/10/23/mushroom-risotto/ RecipeBook XML] output from Cognition.
* [http://srv.buzzword.org.uk/rdf-xml/tobyinkster.co.uk/blog/2008/10/23/mushroom-risotto/ RDF/XML] and [http://srv.buzzword.org.uk/turtle/tobyinkster.co.uk/blog/2008/10/23/mushroom-risotto/ Turtle] output from Cognition.


== related pages ==
== related pages ==
* [[recipe]]
[[recipe]] effort per the process:
* [[recipe-examples]]
* [[recipe-examples]]
* [[recipe-formats]]
* [[recipe-formats]]
* [[recipe-brainstorming]] (see also [[recipe-brainstorming-archive]])
* [[recipe-issues]]
* [[recipe-issues]]
See now:
* [[hRecipe]]
* [[hrecipe-issues|hRecipe issues]]

Latest revision as of 04:57, 4 April 2010

Towards a Recipe microformat. Please read the process before editing this page.


For the sake of clarity the format-in-progress from september 2007 was moved to recipe-brainstorming-archive. ThomasLoertsch 14:12, 11. Nov 2008 (CET)

format-in-progress - #2 - october 2008

Also the format-in-progress from october 2008 has been moved to recipe-brainstorming-archive. --ThomasLoertsch 12:49, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

brainstorming

RecipeML-based Brainstorm

NOTE: Brainstorms should be based on implied schema of examples, not on explicit schema of other formats. The only exceptions where this appears to have been ok (perhaps I got lucky) was with hCard (based on vCard) and hCalendar (based on iCalendar), but even in those cases, experience has shown that there are several properties in each that in practice have not shown much if any use, therefore indicating that the microformats were/are bigger than they need(ed) to be. Tantek 23:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Excerpted from Conor Bandon's Blog entry and derived from The RecipeML Spec:

  • Recipe_Title
  • Summary Description (one liner)
  • Measurement System (U.S., Imperial etc)
  • Ingredients (each one a separate "item" rather than block text with count/amount/range/unit broken out too)
    • Some (e.g. meats, vegetables) could optionally be marked up with (elements of) the proposed species microformat. Andy Mabbett 06:41, 16 Nov 2006 (PST)
      • None of the recipe-examples show references to species names, therefore there is no empirical justification for inclusion of such detail in the microformat. Tantek 23:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
        • The vast majority of recipes reference a species of plant or animal (e.g. "chicken", "carrot"). Binomial/trinomial names are pretty much never seen of course, but the current species proposal allows for vernacular (common) names to be marked up, so it is not an especially odd suggestion to define a pattern for marking up species within ingredients. TobyInk 20:11, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Ingredient importance (e.g. Main, Required, Optional) should be listed as an attribute of each entry. α
    • Units need separate microformat: see measure
    • Ingredient Preparation: such as diced, chopped, sliced, grated, minced, etc. Steve Lewis 18:55, 11 Feb 2007 (PST)
  • Preparation Time (overall time)
  • Yield Quantity and Unit (4 pancakes or 5 servings)
  • Background Information - Optional section to encapsulate information that is useful but not necessarily required for a successful recipe. α
    • Author (Person) (hcard?)
    • Submitter (Person) (hcard?)
    • Source (Book Title etc)
    • Date (Of Creation or Publication)
    • Rights (Copyright or other)
    • Meal Category (Starter, entree, dessert )
    • Cuisine Category (Italian etc)
  • Instructions (text, but can contain:)
    • Steps (optional)
      • Should be an ordered list Andy Mabbett 14:46, 16 Nov 2006 (PST)
      • Another vote for an ordered list, perhaps in the XOXO format. α
      • Many recipes associate ingredients with specific steps of a multi-step method; if methods are broken out into steps, then the format should support this association whether the complete ingredient list is up front or the ingredient list is itself broken out per step. Ben Curtis
  • Photo (optional) Cameron Perry
    • Could be one per dish, or one for each (or for some of the) step(s). Andy Mabbett

Cookcamp brainstorming

At CookCamp in February 2007, Tantek moderated a fairly free form discussion of how to publish/share recipes. Here is a photo of the whiteboard: 422072573_9956d93f61.jpg

To Do: OCR this and enter rough notes here...

Additional Suggestions

  • Steps - As cited above but to include estimated time per step. Include the type of step (prep, preheat, cook, bake, mix, saute, etc) as well as the ingredients involved. This would be very useful when trying to time a meal so all the food appears together.
    • I think this is being to specific. Are there any real world examples where this would be useful? --Yde 08:41, 30 May 2008 (PDT)
  • Difficulty/Notes - Perhaps incorporation of hReview to describe difficulty (using rating) and general comments (review), as an optional field. Frances Berriman
    • -1. Too diverse in the wild, better handled bytags (at least in the first version). same for suitablility.
  • Suitability (e.g. vegetarian, vegan, wheat-free, etc.). Possibly rel-tag. Andy Mabbett 14:57, 16 Nov 2006 (PST)
  • Ingredient Grouping - In baking you need to differentiate wet from dry ingredients. See also an example recipe from extratasty.com for useful grouping in cocktail mixing. Steve Lewis 19:10, 11 Feb 2007
    • Maybe this ingredient grouping can be used to express some alternative ingredients, like "mayonnaise or cream cheese". Estêvão Samuel Procópio 15:33, 16 Dez 2007 (PDT)
    • This could be solved by using a xoxo list and ignoring list items that don't include a class="name". Example:

<ul class="ingredients">
  <li>Booze
    <ul>
      <li>1 part <span class="name">Rum</span></li>
    </ul>
  </li>
  <li>Mixer
    <li>1 part <span class="name">Cola</span></li>
    <li>1 part <span class="name">Lime juice</span></li>
  </li>
</ul> --Yde 13:09, 18 Apr 2008 (PDT)

    • We can't have a dependency on XOXO or any list mark-up for ingredients. That's too restrictive on publishing patterns, preventing patterns like: 


<p class="method">Take <span class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">a handful</span> 


of  spinach</span> and fry it</p> --BenWard 13:20, 18 Apr 2008 (PDT)

    • You're right. I think grouping would introduce too many new elements (class="group", class="group-title") considering how relatively uncommon this is. --Yde 13:51, 23 Apr 2008 (PDT)


  • Method > Steps - or Method-Step[] as a child of Method. Imply ordered steps from an HTML list or explicitly mark-up ordered steps respectively.

    • -1. Outside 80/20. POSH is good enough for this purpose. --ThomasLoertsch 15:04, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)
    • 

  • Number of dishes or similar - often it's mentioned how many dishes (or breads in baking, etc) the ingredients are for. WilleRaab 16:57, 20 Jul 2007 (PDT)
    • 

  • Suitable for occasions - what occasions are the dish suitable for? WilleRaab 16:57, 20 Jul 2007 (PDT)
    • 

  • Category - many sites categorize their recipes. WilleRaab 16:57, 20 Jul 2007 (PDT)

    • Tags could be used for both suitability and category.


  • Under what terms is the recipe licensed? Microformat: rel="license". Often a page is in the creative commons but the page author has taken some text from a copyrighted page and in theory re-published the work in violation to the terms of use, adding a rel="license" to each recipe on the page? Lee Jordan 20:55, 04 Feb 2008 (GMT)


  • Single foodstuffs - If "method" is made optional, this could be used for marking up individual foodstuffs in prose. for example, "I like to eat cheese for supper." would become:


I like to eat <span class="hRecipe"><span class="ingredient">cheese</span></span> for supper.



or simply (if the proposed "sub-microformat-pattern" is adopted):



I like to eat <span class="hRecipe-ingredient">cheese</span> for supper.



Andy Mabbett 08:16, 5 Jan 2008 (PST)


    • But that's not really a recipe, is it? And what would the purpose of knowing that cheese is an ingredient be? --Yde 12:46, 18 Apr 2008 (PDT)
      • 

    • -1. Makes no sense to me either --ThomasLoertsch 15:29, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)


  • Menus - With the addition of a "price" field, and perhaps one or two others, and again making "method" optional, this microformat can also be used for menus. See menu examples. Andy Mabbett 02:39, 19 Feb 2008 (PST)

    • I would consider this out of scope (which is to produce an as-simple-as-possible microformat "for the mark-up of instructions for creating meals, drinks or food-based items" -  introduction) --Yde 13:39, 23 Apr 2008 (PDT)


Quantity


There are a lot of units typically used in recipes that do not make much sense in most other cases and therefor most likely will never make it into a 80/20-aware measure-microformat. This is a deliberatly short list:



  • cup
    • 

  • leave
    • 

  • pinch
    • 

  • tablespoonful
    • 

  • teaspoonful
    • 

  • lacing
    • 

  • tie (??? my english is really leaving me here, hope you get the idea)


note can be used to indicate more subtle differentiation (like a "big spoonful", "some leaves" etc). I think this list is both usefully short and complete. The following measures:



  • weight (gram)
    • 

  • volume (litre)
    • 

  • length (metre)


can be taken from the measure microformat. I guess measure is already stable enough that it's save to use these terms "experimentally". The measure-element should be optional. That way nobody is forced to select a value from it - it's just a help to facilitate interoperability. --ThomasLoertsch 15:45, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)



Proposed Optimisations


Item


Can we have this optimisation?... if no "item" is found, the entire ingredient is taken to be the item. TobyInk

Example:



<span class="ingredient">salt</span>


is a shorthand for:



<span class="ingredient"><span class="item">salt</span></span>


  • +1. That and the Proposed Ingredient List Optimisation seem to be very pragmatic proposals. --Yde 14:40, 14 Jul 2008 (PDT)
    • 

  • -1. I'm not convinced that it's wise to introduce variations in the syntax for the singlemost important element (beside the title). Also the case seems very rare to me. Can you give some examples? --ThomasLoertsch 15:07, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)


Ingredient List


TobyInk 03:42, 23 Mar 2008 (PDT):

If class="ingredients" (note: plural) is found on an element, class="ingredient" (note: singular) is automatically implied on all its children.



<ul class="ingredients">
<li><span class="quantity">3</span> <span class="item">eggs</span></li>
<li><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">self-raising flour</span></li>
<li><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">caster sugar</span></li>
<li><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">butter</span></li>
<li><span class="quantity">1 tsp</span> <span class="item">vanilla essence</span></li>
</ul>


is a shorthand for:



<ul class="ingredients">
<li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">3</span> <span class="item">eggs</span></li>
<li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">self-raising flour</span></li>
<li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">caster sugar</span></li>
<li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">6 oz</span> <span class="item">butter</span></li>
<li class="ingredient"><span class="quantity">1 tsp</span> <span class="item">vanilla essence</span></li>
</ul>


  • I agree. This would save a lot of space, especially combined with the proposed hmeasure minimisation technique. --Yde 12:57, 18 Apr 2008 (PDT)
    • 

  • Do we have ingredients (plural) as an element? Doesn't that open a whole can of list-issues? --ThomasLoertsch 15:37, 01 Oct 2008 (CET)


Promoting hRecipe for use in Recipe Search Indexing


My company has an interest in the establishment and adoption of a recipe-based microformat in support of our goal to index recipe content for search.

We would like to promote a few POSH extensions to hRecipe that we think will be useful to the recipe-publishing community in support of our shared intention to promote hRecipe's adoption as a standard.

I have outlined these extensions (and our rationale) below and would like to ask the community for comment in advance of any publication. After comment, we will host a public page outlining the extensions which will refer to microformats.org as the authoritative source for hRecipe.

(My intent is also to share whatever data we collect on the adoption of hRecipe in the sites we index, which will include smaller blogger sites where we expect hRecipe will initially be most prevalent.)

--DaveCorboy 03:43, 22 March 2010 (UTC)



  • We have now published the page I reference above here. --DaveCorboy 04:57, 4 April 2010 (UTC)


Proposed Extensions


comment


  • An inline comment for an ingredient within the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. Text. Limited to one comment per ingredient.
    • 

  • Rationale: We have seen a number of examples in the wild of comments mixed in with ingredients. comment allows the expression of a standard ingredient list while also allowing for prose-style lists and additional commentary (e.g., substitutions) related to specific ingredients.


Example



<ul>
  <li class="ingredient">1 cup of walnuts or pecans
    <span class="comment">
      (Though I usually prefer pecans in most recipes, I like walnuts best in this.)
    </span>
  </li>
</ul>



step


  • The steps necessary to prepare the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. Text. No limit to the total number of steps per recipe. Use of step properties within an instructions block are optional, but recommended.
    • 

  • Rationale: The Cooking for Engineers website is an excellent real-world example of the many alternative recipe writing styles described in this paper. hRecipe has reasonably closed this as an immediate need, however we wish to try to accommodate this sort of prose-style recipes that do not have an explicit collection of steps.


Example



<div class="instructions">
  <p>So before we get to the recipe, let me tell you a story about cranberries...</p>
  <p>
    Now, let's get to cooking! First, you will need to <span class="step">coarsely grind the cranberries. Fill your blender 2/3 full...</span>
    After you have done this, you will need to <span class="step">pour the blender contents into your strainer and let the liquid...</span>
  </p>
  <p>
    All this cooking reminds me of the apple farm where I grew up...
    Now that you know where apples come from, you will need to <span class="step">peel and dice the apples and add them to the drained cranberries.</span>
  </p>
</div>



preptime


  • Time it takes for the preparation step of the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. Text or the property may be encoded using the value-class-pattern. Limited to one preptime per recipe.
    • 

  • Rationale: We add preptime and cooktime to help publishers express these values explicitly and request only one duration property to express total time for the recipe.


Example



<h6>Preparation time: <span class="preptime">5 minutes</span></h6>



cooktime


  • Time it takes for the cooking step of the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. Text or the property may be encoded using the value-class-pattern. Limited to one cooktime per recipe.
    • 

  • Rationale: We add preptime and cooktime to help publishers express these values explicitly and request only one duration property to express total time for the recipe.


Example



<h6>Cooking time: <span class="cooktime">25 minutes</span></h6>



tag


  • One or more tags (cuisine, keyword, etc.) for the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. No limit to number of tag  properties per recipe.
    • 

  • Rationale: Our use of tagging is very different from the use-case of rel-tag which requires a tagspace. In our use case, we need to allow users of the microformat the ability to associate descriptive words to a recipe, but cannot require they also construct a web infrastructure. This view is correctly rejected by the rel-tag issues reviewers citing large-scale sites such as Flickr and del.icio.us. Perhaps "tags" is simply the wrong term for us?


Example



<span class="tag">Salad</span>
<span class="tag">Fruit</span>



category


  • Category of the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. Limited to one category per recipe.
    • 

  • Rationale: While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the category of the recipe is often treated differently in published recipes and we'd like to try to promote it out of the tags.


Example



<span class="category">Side dish</span>



difficulty


  • Difficulty level of preparing the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. The value should be encoded as a fraction using the value-title class defined in the value-class-pattern. Limited to one difficulty per recipe.
    • 

  • Rationale: While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the difficulty of the recipe is often expressed in published recipes as a specific ratio.


Example



<span class="difficulty"><span class="value-title" title="1/3" />Easy</span>



rating


  • Rating of the recipe.
    • 

  • Optional. The value should be encoded as a fraction using the value-title class defined in the value-class-pattern. Limited to one rating per recipe.
    • 

  • While hRecipe recommends tags for this, we find that the rating of the recipe is often expressed in published recipes as a specific ratio.


Example



<span class="rating"><span class="value-title" title="4/5" /><img src="/images/4-out-of-5-stars.jpg" /></span>



issues


Issues have been moved to a seperate recipe-issues  page.



implementations


Cognition


As of September 2008, Cognition has experimental support for this format. (Details of support.) Recipes may be exported in RecipeBook XML format or RDF.



examples in the wild


Wild Mushroom, Pancetta & Truffle Risotto by Toby Inkster




related pages


recipe effort per the process:




See now:





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