[uf-discuss] hCard: url and tel

[Tantek Ç elik]

On 1/8/08 12:08 AM, "Andy Mabbett" <andy at pigsonthewing.org.uk> wrote:

> In message <C3A80E8D.9A3FE%tantek at cs.stanford.edu>, Tantek Çelik
> <tantek at cs.stanford.edu> writes
> 
> 
>>>> properties!=values.  types/schema are not "just as much" data.
>>> 
>>> You seem to be making unsubstantiated assertions and arbitrary
>>> distinctions.
>> 
>> Please stop making the assumption of lack of foundation logical flaw.
> 
> I made no "logical flaw". You posted assertions; and made no attempt to
> substantiate them.

The logical flaw is the *assumption* that your statement made that there was
no (or appeared to be no) foundation/substantiantion for my assertion.  You
can't know that, therefore the assumption is invalid.

Such invalid assumptions do not contribute to debate, and are not helpful.

As I said, rather than assuming a lack of substantiation, simply ask for it,
as the guidelines indicate.


>> http://microformats.org/wiki/mailing-list#Avoid_logical_flaws
>> 
>> <http://microformats.org/wiki/logical-flaws#Assumptions_of_lack_of_foundatio
>> n_or_justification>
> 
> Posting URLs of your own assertions on the wiki as though they were
> evidence contributed little to the debate.

Those are not my assertions, but merely documentation of a logical flaw.

If you dispute that logical flaw, please indicate *why* you think that
logical flaw is itself flawed, perhaps in a nested list item, on the wiki.


>>> Consider:
>>> 
>>>       street- vs. extended- address
>> 
>> sub-properties of adr property
>> 
>>> 
>>>       given- vs. additional- name
>> 
>> sub-properties of n property
>> 
>> 
>>>       work- vs. home- tel
>> 
>> *values* for 'type' sub-property of tel property.
> 
> Arbitrary distinctions.

Not arbitrary, but based on distinctions made in vCard, hence I cited:

>> These distinctions come from RFC 2426 as well as
>> http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-design-methodology
>> Read both carefully to understand these distinctions better.
> 
> I'm fully aware of both the source and meaning of those terms.

Then I suggest re-reading RFC2426 to better understand the source of the
distinctions, rather than categorizing them as "arbitrary".


>> <theoretical example deleted>
> 
> The examples were not theoretical, but real (though surname changed out
> of courtesy to the person concerned.

Please provide a URL to a public resource on the Web to substantiate the
assertion that they are "real" for the purposes of microformats.


>>>> Hence why microformats focus on real world examples on the web that are
>>>> also *common*.
>>> 
>>> And people *commonly* publish what are clearly and unambiguously (to
>>> humans, but not, without the additional mark-up of a microformat, to
>>> machines) home or work telephone numbers, without saying as much on the
>>> page.
>> 
>> Same thing. needs real world example URL. please document on hcard-issues.
> 
> <http://tinyurl.com/2w4r3v>

Thank you.  Please document on hcard-issues.


Tantek