[uf-discuss] Re: DOM scripting as an alternative to include-pattern?

Tantek Ç elik tantek at cs.stanford.edu
Mon Jun 5 01:18:28 PDT 2006


First of all welcome.  Glad to hear you are trying things out with hCard and
hCalendar, and thanks for reporting where you have found challenges.

Feel free to document the issues you run into on the respective issues
pages, e.g. http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-issues

Regarding some of the thoughts/proposals.

It is a well known maxim in data format design circles to avoid procedural
aspects in data formats completely if not as much as possible.

In addition, the argument for including more features requires
justification, not the lack of a justification.

The object-include pattern solved the precise need that arose in-common
among hReview and hResume, and even in those cases, as a result of actual
experience working with the formats and iteration.

Any kind of scripting/programming MUST NOT be included as even an optional
portion of a data format (with the one exception of a completely opaque
chunk the handling of which is left to outside the specification, e.g.
javascript: URLs, or image formats in photos which may themselves contain
scripts) in order for the data to be maximally safe and most easily consumed
by search engines and browsers alike.



(IMHO we may want to consider adding this as an FAQ).

On 6/3/06 7:01 PM, "Michael Leikam" <leikam at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Steve,
> My hunch is that if js/dom isn't supported or generates an
> error then the parser should ignore this DOM manipultation
> step and move on to the XHTML-to-TargetFormat
> transformation.  
> A well-formed piece of content should remain well-formed
> regardless of whether any additions are successful.  We
> also shouldn't advocate marking up content as
> microformatted which doesn't contain necessary fields (like
> dtstart for  hcal).  The inclusion of content outside the
> top-level tags should be an enhancement and an elaboration
> of already appropriately marked up data.
> One of my frustrations with hcal/hcard markup is that on
> many of my pages, other parts of the page lend context to
> the content which is lost when that content is extracted
> and republished in a different context.  For example, on an
> "about us" page, the company name doesn't need to be placed
> next to every employee's title since it's a company page,
> but that's exactly what I want when the person's address is
> extracted and added to somebody's address book.  A minimal
> vCard is better than nothing, but a more complete one would
> be preferable.
> -ml
> --- Steve Robillard <s.robillard at snet.net> wrote:
>> Michael,
>>> From a purely accessible stand point what happens to the
>> redundant data and
>> the understandability/utility of the complete data when
>> JavaScript is
>> disabled, and does not included the redundant data?
>> Thanks, 
>> Steve 
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