[uf-new] Album Vs audio-title (was hAudio ITEM debate proposal #3)

Scott Reynen scott at makedatamakesense.com
Tue Oct 30 06:19:31 PST 2007

On Oct 30, 2007, at 6:34 AM, Martin McEvoy wrote:

>>> FN does *not* mean album name.  It means *audio* name.  Whether or  
>>> not that's the same as the album name determines whether or not  
>>> we're talking about an album.
> That Is YOUR definition

It is, but only because that's the definition of FN in the wiki:


"The name of the object."

The object of an hAudio is an audio recording, so FN in hAudio means  
"the name of the audio recording."  The definition of ALBUM on the  
other hand, is the name of the album.  That the album is sometimes  
also the recording does not make those two definitions the same.   
Similarly the terms "big" and "elephant" do not have the same meaning  
merely because they often refer to the same object.

>> This is a pattern taken directly from hCard, another context in  
>> which subtypes are not explicitly stated but can still be  
>> determined by which elements are present.  If you think hAudio  
>> should differ from hCard here, please explain why.
> are you meaning that  "fn album" is an optimization  based on  
> something like  the  nickname optimization in  hCard  ?

It's not an optimization, and it's not related to nickname.  It's an  
indirect way of indicating subtype when a subtype is not explicitly  
stated, just like we use the identical value of FN and ORG to indicate  
the subtype of the hCard is organization.

> All I am suggesting is that we should forget about any "fn album"  
> optimization for now and keep it simple.

It seems to me we're talking about two different definitions of what  
those terms mean.  Take a look at how FN and ORG work in hCard; it's  
the same pattern.  If you don't like this pattern, I'd like to hear  
why, but you seem to be objecting to a definition of these terms that  
doesn't match previous use (e.g. what FN means above), so I don't  
really understand your objection.

> Now that  item / fn has been accepted to described hAudio  tracks,  
> there is no real need to complicate hAudio any more than saying that  
> audio-title is the main hAudio title and fn is a track title and  
> leave it there.

How should we describe a single track and its album title?  Currently  
we'd do that like this:

<p class="haudio">
	I like the song <span class="fn">Everything in Its Right Place</span>  
on <span class="album">Kid A</span>.

I'm not clear what you see as the alternative without separate  

Scott Reynen

More information about the microformats-new mailing list